Does Aerith manifest Zack?>------If that makes sense?

[GalaxyFlare]

There was a theory floating around FFF a few months or a month ago about Other Ancients being able Manifest the same way Aeris/Aerith does?

Which got me thinking, we see in AC and ACC Zack walking around in the same fashion as Aeris but the dude is just a regular human, he has no ancient powers like Aeris to call upon.

Plus we only ever see Zack with Aeris in the Lifestream, never by himself?
Which leads ,me to believe that Aeris is keeping Zack from becoming apart of the Lifestream proper.

I have a few queries about that.

#1 Is this fair to do to Zack? he may want to die like a normal human?

#2 His soul my degrade being in limbo unable to move on to the next plain.

#3 If you believe the theory, Is it selfish of Aeris to perpetuate Zacks existence un-naturally?

This is all highly speculative and not in the least bit Canon, but what do you guys think?

 

[Noize]

I don't think Zack particularly minds. he's re-united with Aerith so it's all like in/near the Lifestream....

I reckon the lifestream itself summoned Aerith and Zack to another plane, or so-to-speak. They're not funny absorbed into the Lifestream like normal souls....

Either that or Clouds been Hit in the head WAY too many times and he can't differentiate his delusions from reality and can't get the 2 out of his head..

(using AC as references)

 

[Baron Van Wolfen]

1) I'd imagine zack wouldn't particularly mind. Especially if he gets to see his love aerith, and his bestest friend ever: cloud.

2) Maybe, we really don't know how that works.

3) I myself am inclined to think zack himself keeps his existance separate in the lifestream. All he needs is a strong enough will. Like cloud's or seph's who both could be higher in the willpower chain than even minerva. But i would guess aerith perpetuates his image to cloud's mind in the physical world.

 

[Howl]

I think Zack did become part of the lifestream and that Aerith is able to identify his presence. So maybe Aerith is using her power from within the lifestream to create a manifestation of Zack so that Cloud can see them both a-lookin' happy.

 

[tilinelson2]

I liked this last possibility because it makes more sense than Zack being able to manifest himself.

 

[The Witch]

Aerith allows Zack to manifest for the brief time in AC because... Cloud needed him. I'm pretty sure after he gave Cloud the pep talk in ACC he went back to rest in the lifestream, like he was in Maiden.


Aerith's not keeping him around against his will or something.

She just allowed him to visit Cloud briefly so he could help his pal out.

 

[Dragon Mage]

Or, how about this stunning answer:

Maybe they are just ghosts and are manifesting however ghosts do? And they both manifested independently?



Wow. Thank you, Occam.

 

[tilinelson2]

Or, how about this stunning answer:

Maybe they are just ghosts and are manifesting however ghosts do? And they both manifested independently?



Wow. Thank you, Occam.

That doesn´t apply because FFVII world says things don´t work that way, people return to the lifestream. It is a form of Pantheism common to some religions, different from the traditional afterlife view that people hold their individuality as ghosts or souls.

Occam usually leads to wrong conclusions, take care.

 

[Dragon Mage]

Okay, so humor fail. On the high end of a scale from 1 to LOL. Jolly good, chap.

How do you explain the Ancient at the Temple? Technically, he'd qualify as a ghost. So if there can be one ghost, what prevents other ghosts from popping up for a short time and then happily going back to their Lifestream? Hell, who even said that they leave the Lifestream in the first place? Aren't you supposed to be able to "watch" loved ones when you're dead?

And okay, Pantheism is a common idea in a lot of ancient religions. But where does it ever say that there is no 'individuality' after death? Didn't Aerith tell her adopted mother that her husband had died and was coming to see her but joined the planet before he could? Doesn't that qualify as retaining personal identity after death? It says nowhere that Pantheism is the actual form of religion in FF7, they just share a lot in common in metaphysics. So, nowhere does it say that in all Pantheistic religions, all "souls" or whathaveyou merge together and there's no individuality. Nomura himself said that the individual consciousness does live on.

And actually, Occam was pretty darn right. Why does a man take water from the well? Because he's thirsty, not because he's poisoning it and wants to get an untainted supply for himself. :dave: If you think Occam was wrong, then you must be paranoid.

 

[tilinelson2]

Okay, so humor fail. On the high end of a scale from 1 to LOL. Jolly good, chap.

How do you explain the Ancient at the Temple? Technically, he'd qualify as a ghost. So if there can be one ghost, what prevents other ghosts from popping up for a short time and then happily going back to their Lifestream? Hell, who even said that they leave the Lifestream in the first place? Aren't you supposed to be able to "watch" loved ones when you're dead?

And okay, Pantheism is a common idea in a lot of ancient religions. But where does it ever say that there is no 'individuality' after death? Didn't Aerith tell her adopted mother that her husband had died and was coming to see her but joined the planet before he could? Doesn't that qualify as retaining personal identity after death? It says nowhere that Pantheism is the actual form of religion in FF7, they just share a lot in common in metaphysics. So, nowhere does it say that in all Pantheistic religions, all "souls" or whathaveyou merge together and there's no individuality. Nomura himself said that the individual consciousness does live on.

And actually, Occam was pretty darn right. Why does a man take water from the well? Because he's thirsty, not because he's poisoning it and wants to get an untainted supply for himself. :dave: If you think Occam was wrong, then you must be paranoid.

Now you wanted to be funny, but missed the point. What a stupid example to support Occam, I think you consider yourself pretty smart for coming with this ridiculous example.

Every ghost you see is Ancient.

Nomura said lots of different things in lots of different interviews.

If you don´t have anything related to the game story to answer, leave the discussion as it is because you are not helping.

 

[Dragon Mage]

Well, he said that particular bit in the special features of AC. Look into it, it's quite interesting.

I've actually answered quite a bit pertaining to the game story, listing examples straight from the game to back my opinion.

You are most certainly not helping either. You're not providing any answer of your own. You are, in short, a troll. I gave my answer, and you seem to take particular affront with it. Are you from Locution? That would explain a lot. You're doing nothing but insulting me, so I'll let the mods handle you.

 

[Ilyena]

Alright people, let's retract those claws. No need to insult one another. Disagreeing with someone's point of view is fine but do not resort to insulting other members. This will be the only warning in this thread. Thanks.

 

[tilinelson2]

Well, he said that particular bit in the special features of AC. Look into it, it's quite interesting.

I've actually answered quite a bit pertaining to the game story, listing examples straight from the game to back my opinion.

You are most certainly not helping either. You're not providing any answer of your own. You are, in short, a troll. I gave my answer, and you seem to take particular affront with it. Are you from Locution? That would explain a lot. You're doing nothing but insulting me, so I'll let the mods handle you.

For me, an interview is always an interview, no matter where it is. Authors tend to change their opinions like the direction of the wind about their own stories when interviewed.

Not helping? I´ve agreed with a opinion I liked and told you why your opinion, according to what you can see in the FFVII world, is not correct. Keep your focus on the discussion, you know who started it all with sarcastic comments.