PC Best upgrade for aging computer...

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

This technically isn't directly gaming related, so much as related to capturing footage of games, as well as editing the videos.

My computer now is... old. But I also don't have the money to upgrade to a brand new one; not even close. So I was wondering if anyone here had ideas for good upgrades I could do to allow me to consistently capture higher quality 720p footage (without dropping frames... I have to drop the quality of the capture to the lowest it goes, which looks muddy), and render videos faster (as well as maybe work with more video tracks at once in editing)? To capture, I'm using an elgato HD and the provided software. The elgato does most of the processing while capturing. But the software still taxes my hardware enough to drop frames if I'm playing fast paced, visually diverse games with the capture quality too high. Another problem might be the D-Terminal cable required to capture from PS3, because the bandwidth is significantly smaller than HDMI. I can pretty consistently capture off of the 360 at max quality 720p, and I believe it's because you capture from 360 using HDMI.

The computer I have right now is a laptop. I know, they generally aren't terribly upgradeable. But this one was specifically designed to have limited upgrade-ability.

It's a Dell Studio laptop from 2008 (told you it was old). It's specifically model 1555, which includes an Intel Core2 Duo T6400 @ 2GHz, an ATi Radeon 3450 HD 256mg GPU, a 320gb HDD (I don't know the RPM), and 4gb of DDR2 RAM.

I'm pretty sure the CPU is the only thing that can't be upgraded, though obviously the GPU would still have to fit and cool correctly if upgraded. Meanwhile it's got two RAM slots, and it's capable of seeing 4gb sticks in each for a total of 8gb, but I think the motherboard is limited to only using DDR2. There's also the option of upgrading to a hybrid drive or an SSD... or changing to another, newer but cheap computer. However, I really can't spend more than maybe $200 max, which I know is severely limiting.

Any ideas would be appreciated

 

[iSmiff]

You need to be very careful. You need to make sure everything you look at upgrading that the parts are compatible with the CPU. Don't wanna go spending hundreds on parts only to find they wont work.

If you're on a budget you'd be surprised what some good RAM or an SSD could achieve. You could probably double your ram and install a secondary HD for that price. You guys get good deals compared to us europeans anyway so can't really complain about bargains

Once you done that i'd upgrade the graphics card later but you just need to weigh up the costs of purchasing these parts v.s the costs of buying a new laptop - You'd be surprised how cheap gaming rigs are becoming these days with the rise of gaming in the past 5/10 years.

is $200 half way towards a good machine? It probably is. Alienware announced last night at E3 they have machines for $500 that are potentially VR Capable (with an add-on in the future) so you know that's a decent machine right there.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

If you're on a budget you'd be surprised what some good RAM or an SSD could achieve.

Once you done that i'd upgrade the graphics card later but you just need to weigh up the costs of purchasing these parts v.s the costs of buying a new laptop - You'd be surprised how cheap gaming rigs are becoming these days with the rise of gaming in the past 5/10 years.

Those were my thoughts, but not being an expert on these things, I don't know exactly in what way/to what degree these things will improve performance.

And I've seriously thought about just getting a new computer. But I would definitely prefer a laptop, because I like to chillax on my bed while illustrating. And I need a mobile computer for that. Unfortunately, laptops are obviously more expensive than the desktop equivalents.

 

[Paddy McGee]

Those were my thoughts, but not being an expert on these things, I don't know exactly in what way/to what degree these things will improve performance.

And I've seriously thought about just getting a new computer. But I would definitely prefer a laptop, because I like to chillax on my bed while illustrating. And I need a mobile computer for that. Unfortunately, laptops are obviously more expensive than the desktop equivalents.

Regarding capturing on a machine, do know that video capture utilises the CPU over the GPU(they're pretty different to each other under the hood). As such, I'm not quite sure the upgrades suggested here will have an impact. This would be why I would suggest looking at getting a new machine of some sort. If you can budget out more money, and if you wanted the help, the people here would be more than willing to give advice for choices.

Now, going down the route of buying a new machine, refurbished laptops are not actually a bad choice. You can get what you want for a lot cheaper by going that route. Some people prefer new- which is perfectly fine- but it's maybe worth a look.

Anyway:

Adding a SSD to your laptop will speed up I/O and boot time substantially. Seriously, I highly recommend getting a SSD, especially if you decide to get a new machine. Do NOT get the hybrid drives. They don't particularly work that well and generally the Hybrids used in laptops right now are not stable(Friend of mine had his fry out, mine fried out on a laptop I just bought). Do not settle for scrimping here; get a Solid State Drive.

Getting RAM to match your motherboard, since it's old, might be a bit hard. I'm not sure how many different slots it has for RAM either. Perhaps you could put up the model number so we can do some research and work towards the goal together? I feel that 8GB would do, but if you wanted definitely push up to 16GB(Depending on if you can upgrade that much). funnily enough, decades ago RAM was the most expensive part of a build; now it's probably the cheapest.

Upgrading your GPU might be tricky. I cannot advise on this aspect.

Lastly, I found a thread regarding your same situation from two years ago on Tom's Hardware: http://www.tomsguide.com/answers/id-2153483/worth-upgrading-aging-dell-studio-1555.html might be worth a look.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

It has two RAM slots; currently at 4gb, with a maximum of 8gb possible.

That being said, I might just look into used laptops instead. I personally hate buying used tech; never had good luck with it. But if I'm careful, it'll hopefully be more beneficial in the long run.

 

[FinalxxSin]

That being said, I might just look into used laptops instead. I personally hate buying used tech; never had good luck with it. But if I'm careful, it'll hopefully be more beneficial in the long run.

Speaking from experience, refurbished laptops have worked well for me for years. They are sent to a manufacturer to make sure they are in working condition, the same as a new laptop. At some point you may want to consider upgrading your Elgato to the HD 60 version, because I know that one can capture content that plays in 60 FPS. I use it for PC gameplay, PS4, and PS3. I don't have any FPS drops from using the Elgato. I don't know what your budget is looking like, but I wouldn't go for a laptop that is less than 2.4 GHZ. a 800 series Nvidia card is still fairly good imo, and in some years I am sure the current 1070 and 1080 will drop in price. Try to avoid getting a laptop that has touch screen, as that will jack the price up for something I don't think would benefit what you are going after.

 

[Setzer Gabbiani]

Speaking from experience, refurbished laptops have worked well for me for years. They are sent to a manufacturer to make sure they are in working condition, the same as a new laptop. At some point you may want to consider upgrading your Elgato to the HD 60 version, because I know that one can capture content that plays in 60 FPS. I use it for PC gameplay, PS4, and PS3. I don't have any FPS drops from using the Elgato. I don't know what your budget is looking like, but I wouldn't go for a laptop that is less than 2.4 GHZ. a 800 series Nvidia card is still fairly good imo, and in some years I am sure the current 1070 and 1080 will drop in price. Try to avoid getting a laptop that has touch screen, as that will jack the price up for something I don't think would benefit what you are going after.

So what type of labtop do you recommend us to buy? What are the best brand? What should we look for on a labtop?

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

Speaking from experience, refurbished laptops have worked well for me for years. They are sent to a manufacturer to make sure they are in working condition, the same as a new laptop. At some point you may want to consider upgrading your Elgato to the HD 60 version, because I know that one can capture content that plays in 60 FPS. I use it for PC gameplay, PS4, and PS3. I don't have any FPS drops from using the Elgato. I don't know what your budget is looking like, but I wouldn't go for a laptop that is less than 2.4 GHZ. a 800 series Nvidia card is still fairly good imo, and in some years I am sure the current 1070 and 1080 will drop in price. Try to avoid getting a laptop that has touch screen, as that will jack the price up for something I don't think would benefit what you are going after.

Oh yeah, I'll definitely avoiding a touch screen. That's what my (originally) $1600 Cintiq drawing tablet is for, lol.

Personally, I don't care much for capturing at 60fps for the foreseeable future. Until I can both capture and render at high quality 1080p (I'm using Lightworks free, which is limited to 720p rendering in H.264 for YouTube), a higher framerate won't make my content look that much better. Plus, the amount of space that footage must take up off of an HDD is probably insane, lol. Plus plus, I tend to capture just as often from older, much lower resolution games anyway, and in my experience the best way to get rid of interlacing judder from such resolutions is to render at 30fps.

Are there laptops that have at least like an i5 3570k and an Nvidia 850m for decent prices? Obviously, even a dual core i3 would be an upgrade, but I get the distinct impression that we're about to reach that point where dual core gets completely left behind.

 

[FinalxxSin]

So what type of labtop do you recommend us to buy? What are the best brand? What should we look for on a labtop?

Are there laptops that have at least like an i5 3570k and an Nvidia 850m for decent prices? Obviously, even a dual core i3 would be an upgrade, but I get the distinct impression that we're about to reach that point where dual core gets completely left behind.

If you are both serious about getting high quality for a fairly decent price, then a laptop isn't going to be able to accomplish that. Only a desktop would. I do understand space and mobility issues though so I have 2 brands to recommend with a backup 3rd. When it comes to laptops, I would aim for gaming oriented ones. There is Lenovo brand (which what I have used for the past couple of years), Asus brand, and as a 3rd to consider looking into would be MSI brand. Please do not consider Alienware as imo they are no longer high quality units. Now and these days, you are paying more for the name, than the parts imo.

- Ram: If you plan on running multiple programs at once that may be a bit taxing on the laptop, I'd recommend looking into something with at least 8 GB of ram, especially if you end up using video editing software like trial versions of Sony Vegas, Adobe After Effects, etc.

- Processor Speed: Processor speed is something that is a factor with FPS. A graphics card is not the only part of that. Basically the processor speed is an indication of how many calculations can be done in a short amount of time. It is possible to have the processor exceed its limit with something called over-clocking, but keep in mind that can generate more heat and/or lower the life time of the processor. I use to use a laptop that had 2.4 GHZ, and it's not enough for a lot of the current games coming out.

-Graphics card: 800 series Nvidia cards are able to run most titles out there anywhere from mid to high range graphically. 900 and 1k series Nvidia cards are still fairly expensive at this point. There are other brands of video gaming cards out there, but I only have experience with Nvidia ones. Normally most programs run on the default graphics card if there is more than one available, but you can right click on a program and change the default video card to the gaming one such as the Nvidia one for example.

- CPU: i5 laptops are still really nice when it comes to cpu. A lot of i7 s and i5 s are basically quad core and may provide a bit better performance, but not all programs take advantage of multi-core processors. Optimization of the actual program will be something out of your hands as a user for the most part. Rather or not a product is dual core or quad core, regardless of it being i7 or i5, will vary from product to product.

-Screen Resolution and rendering: 1080 p is what you should consider aiming for. 720 p is ok if you are watching the content say on a laptop, but on large screen tvs the image will more than likely become blurry some.

As an additional note, when I am recording PC gaming, I use 2 laptops. One I am using to actually play the game, while I have the other recording it though the elgato device that I have. Imo, this is a good way to still make usage out of an old laptop if it is still functional. With console gaming stuff, only 1 laptop is needed in that situation.

This is the laptop I am currently using. While I don't expect either of you to aim for this one, it may perhaps give you both some ideas of what to look for: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TC3EJ7Q/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

If I didn't address your questions in full, please let me know. I apologize in advance if I didn't.

 

[Raiiyokuu]

The easiest route would to be buy a Laptop with at least an i7-6700, a 960m (a 950m will do also) GPU, and 8GB of RAM.

Why?

Because the NVIDIA 900 series GPUs come with an onboard screen capture tech called Shadowplay. I use it a lot on my desktop, and I use it sometimes on my Laptop that has those exact specs. If the ultimate goal is to render and capture in 1080 (even 60FPS), that's the way to do it. If you don't mind shelling out at least $800+

Then you can just take the video and edit it in Vegas, or w/e.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

Gosh, it's surprising how many of those cheaper laptops within the $300-500 range have 720p or nearly 720p displays. Even mine is 900p.

What about those super small desktops that have been coming out recently? For me, it really is just about the balance between desktops being cheaper, and being able to draw comfortably. Sometimes I'm drawing for upwards of 10+ hours straight, which really doesn't work at my desk. But you really pay for the mobility of a laptop, which sucks because I don't take my laptop literally anywhere else but ten feet away from my desk. I only need mobility for that.

If I didn't address your questions in full, please let me know.

I probably should have clarified, that I do understand how each of the pieces of a computer works (Obviously that info was for Lord Sesshomaru as well. I'm just pointing out where I personally stand). And I know about things like overclocking and whatnot. You learn that sort of thing when you delve as deeply into game design as I do. And watching things like Digital Foundry doesn't hurt either. The thing I lack knowledge on is mostly pertaining to what types of PC software tend to tax what parts of the computer the most. Like, with Photoshop for example. My current computer can (thankfully) do just fine up to absolutely enormous canvas sizes, including ones as big as 16000 by 9000 at 600dpi. But my computer struggles to keep up when I'm working on something half as big, and simultaneously using a brush at 250px or bigger; brush updates are no longer in real time at that point. And once the PSD file size gets above like 130mb, redrawing while zooming in and out is no longer done in real time.

Or in Lightworks, where I edit videos, it takes around an hour to render a 35 minute video in H.264 at 720p. The editor itself is generally lighter than Premiere, which I used the trial for before. But the preview windows don't allow resolution scaling, meaning the previews are in the resolution of the video itself. So it skips frames when fast forwarding or rewinding 720p footage, or watching previews with two or more video elements present at once. I therefore have to sync up multiple video pieces by ear and by looking at the timeline, because I have very little (if any) visual information to use.

My issue is that -since PC software can hit a much higher variety of hardware components in vastly different ways- I can't as easily apply my knowledge on these subjects, since it mostly applies to games (and mostly to consoles at that).

I don't play games on PC... at all. I'm one of the three people left in the world that still doesn't even have a Steam account, lol. So I personally am not concerned with being able to run games. But that also means I don't have much experience with tinkering with any form of PC software, game or otherwise. As such, I haven't learned the strengths and weaknesses of them, so to speak. That also means that I don't need to worry about capturing from my computer itself; only from consoles. The Elgato does most of the work, as it should. But the software still bogs my computer down a bit. I just don't know why, so I don't know what upgrades will fix it.

 

[Raiiyokuu]

The only thing you'd really need to upgrade, at the end of the day, whether it's laptop, or Desktop is the CPU, and RAM, if you want a nice smooth experience for your system not bogging down.

But I don't think CPUs are upgradeable on a laptop, since they're bound to a specific motherboard socket. Not only that, you have to actually do some work to get to it, I've never tried it with a laptop CPU. Memory is easily upgradeable these days for either.

Also think about getting an SSD. Not only does it boot your system faster, but it also accesses the data quicker.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

The only thing you'd really need to upgrade, at the end of the day, whether it's laptop, or Desktop is the CPU, and RAM, if you want a nice smooth experience for your system not bogging down.

But I don't think CPUs are upgradeable on a laptop, since they're bound to a specific motherboard socket. Not only that, you have to actually do some work to get to it, I've never tried it with a laptop CPU. Memory is easily upgradeable these days for either.

Also think about getting an SSD. Not only does it boot your system faster, but it also accesses the data quicker.

I'm not entirely sure if my CPU is upgradeable. From what I've seen in the past, that's the only thing that isn't upgradeable on it. Then again, the thread Paddy McGee linked to on Tom's Guide implies that it is; I'm 99% positive that's my exact computer in that thread. I keep forgetting to get the model number, since it's on the bottom of the laptop, and I'm not about to risk damaging an HDD platter by turning it upside down to look while it's running. Regardless, I doubt the motherboard is compatible with any meaningful CPU upgrades. But this laptop was designed to be mildly upgradeable at the time it was released.

 

[FinalxxSin]

.....

10 feet huh. It may be more beneficial for you to get some format of a desktop and run longer cords for when you need to more from location A to location B if the distance is going to be that small. This is going to save you on money in the long run because they are easier to upgrade than a laptop. A good number of people don't really care to mess around with the insides of a laptop too much, so they just typically get a brand new one all together. Far as your taxing programs, that may be a RAM or Processor speed aspect lane issue. It's for sure a RAM issue if you're say rending a video and using Photoshop at the same time, and your programs are struggling to run. Then after that I believe it falls on other aspects such as the processor speed, but don't quote me on that part.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

10 feet huh. It may be more beneficial for you to get some format of a desktop and run longer cords for when you need to more from location A to location B if the distance is going to be that small. This is going to save you on money in the long run because they are easier to upgrade than a laptop. A good number of people don't really care to mess around with the insides of a laptop too much, so they just typically get a brand new one all together. Far as your taxing programs, that may be a RAM or Processor speed aspect lane issue. It's for sure a RAM issue if you're say rending a video and using Photoshop at the same time, and your programs are struggling to run. Then after that I believe it falls on other aspects such as the processor speed, but don't quote me on that part.

Bwahaha! Running Photoshop and rendering videos at the same time?! Do you hail from some sort of time in the future where that's possible or what?!

...Wait... that's actually possible right now?

That's my stupid way of saying that I can't do anything while rendering a video, without making the render take a billion times longer, lol.

 

[FinalxxSin]

....

Sounds like you have a RAM and/or Processor Speed issue to me. The software you're using to render your videos may also be part of the problem, as there may be other software out there that would allow quicker render times.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

I don't think it's the software. From what I remember, Premiere took around the same amount of time. And as a whole -despite a few quirks like the preview window- Lightworks is significantly less demanding on resources in my experience in most areas.

I suppose as a first step, I'll see about just upgrading the RAM. After all, I seriously doubt that two 4gb sticks of DDR2 will cost more than maybe $20.