Love Beyond Friendship: A Cloti Club

[EVA]

the posts in the LTD thread gotten a little tl;dr?

Yeah. I've seriously considered not responding to Ume/Cali unless absolutely necessary. Otherwise, I just end up going in circles with them because they keep telling me/others the same thing over and over again. And incorrectly.

I'm a bit curious as to what they'll say to this new information, though.

 

[looneymoon]

It seems as if my post about evaluating the most credible sources goes unheard, unfortunately. There cannot be a credible discussion if you continue to disregard certain pieces of information. Unless they've been retconned.

sigh, and thus it will forever continue, I suppose

 

[Ryushikaze]

Note: I had addended the above post because I did not realize you had responded.

Text of addenda reposted here.

Addendum: Huh. Dicking through Reunion Files again, the timeline has an interesting note:

Day 1 5:30 PM (Cloudy)
Cloud and Tifa lie unconscious in the flowerbed at the church. They gradually heal on their own and are taken by Reno to the house, where they wake up at 5:30.

So much for Aerith healing them, then.

 

[Fusionist]

Fu~ I concur, the Mideel scene was so sweet. I'd like to think Cloud at least had fuzzy unclear memories of Tifa takin' care of him during that time :3

Random: Do you think Tifa's shorter hair length has something to do with being with Cloud in AC? I heard that cutting one's hair is suppose to be, like, a new beginning or something, and after living through the crisis of meteor in FFVII and getting with Cloud, she might've trimmed a couple of inches >__<

 

[looneymoon]

I think it was because it's hard to animate really long hair. But you never know.

So guys, I've been hearing stuff about Crisis Core being not canon. Can I be enlightened?

 

[EVA]

So guys, I've been hearing stuff about Crisis Core being not canon. Can I be enlightened?

When looking at the source this "stuff" came from, do you really need to be enlightened?

There is no proof that CC is un-canon. It's an official game, with an official Ultimania. [ pleasant smile goes here ]

credible sources goes unheard

That's good, in a way. If it's ignored, I guess there's no defense for it. Not that the 'defenses' presented are all that strong.

I think it was because it's hard to animate really long hair. But you never know.

I really missed Tifa's long 'dolphin tail' hair, but she looked absolutely gorgeous as always in AC without it. I love how Tifa's eyes express so much emotion, same with Cloud.

So much for Aerith healing them, then.

Was it ever stated anywhere, that Aerith was healing Cloud and Tifa in this scene? I thought Aerith was present due to the water drop (watching over them, not laying between them), and I could understand why the thought of Aerith healing them could be plausible... I just never saw a quote or anything about it.

 

[Fusionist]

I know this is off topic, but...

I don't get how CC is NOT canon

It's a game made by the company who made FFVII, hell part of the FFVII team specially; it's part of the compilation, right? How do you argue against games not being canon even? DoC confused me a little bit, but it still stuck with what we know about Vincent in FFVII, right?

FFVII is what everything is based upon, that's I'm sure everyone will agree to. As long as something doesn't mess with that, then it's fine. CC takes place before FFVII, and the after effects of events that took place in that game are easily interpreted to be what they are in FFVII. Why is Aerith wearing pink in FFVII? Because Zack asked her to in CC. Makes sense, no?

And yeah, Zack actually talks to Cloud before he dies which wasn't in FFVII, but the fact that Zack dies in front of Cloud after being shot down by a bunch of Shinra troops is still the same, so the additional content added didn't mess with the original scene in FFVII (which btw is totally optional )

What isn't canon is the anime OVA Last Order since instead of there being added content, it totally changed the scene; instead of Cloud throwing Sephiroth into the Mako, Sephiroth happily jumps in like the mad man he is

I haven't read MotP, and I know this might get me into trouble, but I don't really mind that it was written by someone else outside of Square-Enix. What bugs me is if there are errors within things like time line and what not that contradict what is canon, than it's nothing more than published fanfiction to me *shrugs*

At best, it's a "what if" scenario like Last Order, which like I said, isn't canon (which sucks since one of the main Coti moments was animated so nicely in it ^^)

Okay, getting back on topic:

See how sweet it is

 

[Ryushikaze]

Here's the screwy thing about LO- It is canon. But it's from the perspective of the Turk who was watching. He didn't get to see the fight in its entirely, so he filled in the gaps, which explains the discrepancies.

It's a canonical entry to the compilation, it's just from a limited perspective.
And even he saw the Cloti Moment as Cloti.

 

[Fusionist]

Oh, really? Whoa, I learned something new O.O

So the OVA is the animation version of what the report they wrote up said? Hmm...

And the pic disappeared

 

[EVA]

(which btw is totally optional )

Seriously? O_O What do you have to do to get the scene, then? Because I played Crisis Core on normal, and only did what was required of me (two percent of the missions done) and still got that ending. I didn't do anything special that I was aware of. That was my first time playing, of course. I wasn't eager to do any extras, which I avoid with many of my first play-throughs. I usually play first for plot, then for extras.

(which sucks since one of the main Coti moments was animated so nicely in it ^^)

Though, they included a scene similar in CC. I thought it was just as romantic. <3 Also, LO is included in the time-line, isn't it?

 

[Fusionist]

No, no, no; in the original FFVII game for the PS1, the scene where Zack and Cloud escape before Zack dies is optional >__<

 

[EVA]

Ohh, sorry I misunderstood, haha. And you're right, it is optional. I did happen to get it though. =O

 

[Serene]

Something is canon if the writer(s) consider it a part of the story's continuity. Does this apply to CC? Absolutely. There's no argument against this. Does it apply to MotP? We don't know. Aside from packaging it with the Ultimania Omega, they've never addressed it. They've never mentioned it when going into detail about every other entry in the compilation, or included its events in any timeline.

 

[Fusionist]

Dumb question, but what exactly is the Ultimania Omega? Is it physically a book with all the info, or a couple of books packaged together

And it's only in Japanese?

 

[Cloti]

yeah it is an ultimania, an official book published by the creators thus it's a canon source however the Ultimania Omega was published in 2005 and the 10th anniversary Ultimania was published in 2007.The most recent Ultimania should be taken into account not the older one, that is a mistake the Clerith make over an over again.

To Tifa, Cloud is the only one through which she can get in touch with her past. He is her ideal love and his existence is also like a prince who promised to come to her rescue when she is in trouble.

I love that quote! why do the creators always single out Tifa's feelings?.. they never speak about Aerith's love for Cloud.. I doubt they would want to leave Tifa without her ideal love.

 

[EVA]

I love that quote! why do the creators always single out Tifa's feelings?.. they never speak about Aerith's love for Cloud.. I doubt they would want to leave Tifa without her ideal love.

Hm, now that you mention it, there really is no statement that Aerith herself loves Cloud. Unless of course you count Maiden, but even then it's questionable.

You'd think with the creators stating that Aerith loves Zack, and Tifa loves Cloud, some people would put two and two together. . .

 

[Ryushikaze]

It's not about what SE says, though. It's about what they want to see.

Certain members of the CxA forums believe they know the characters better than Square-Enix themselves.

Edit: And I missed this before.

Was it ever stated anywhere, that Aerith was healing Cloud and Tifa in this scene? I thought Aerith was present due to the water drop (watching over them, not laying between them), and I could understand why the thought of Aerith healing them could be plausible... I just never saw a quote or anything about it.

There is no quote. There is a mangled quote that Aerith is foreshadowed here that is taken to mean she healed them, but no quote that says she healed them.
That still hasn't stopped people from claiming she did, and that the scene is therefore C/A.

 

[Amizon]

But DID Aerith actually state she was healing him? No.

I'm one of those grouchy people that wants to see evidence before believing a theory, which I've seen more than enough to suggest that Cloti is in fact the canon pairing of the series!

 

[Ryushikaze]

Right, so the bits I quoted above are apparently a conglomeration of quotes, largely from the UO- the Tifa sees Cloud as her beloved, her prince is from there, in case you wish to quote- and bring a further note from Hitoshura, who owns the Prologue book- according to AC prologue, Tifa is the only person Cloud has ever opened his heart to, without guard, etc.

So, yes... So much for letting Aerith in.

Specifically...
２年前から、唯一心を許していたティファ。今は彼女にも心を閉ざしている。
Tifa, who from 2 years ago has been the only one Cloud opened his heart to. Now he has closed off his heart even from her.

 

[Cloti]

great quote! should be presented in LTD debates... I don't know in which way it can't be twisted.
It matchs perfectly with "they become aware of the thoughts/feelings each other was holding"