Me leaving the Mormon Faith

[NeroTrinityX]

As some of you know... I was a Latter Day Saint, or rather... a Mormon... Well, a few days ago I was studying, and I came across a Revelation from Brigham Young, that Black People were born from the Mark of Cain, and were therefore unable to get into heaven... I was like... Okay, I didn't see this coming (I was offended, I heard this changed but the damage was done already)... so I begin digging a bit deeper, Yes they have the Book of Mormon as another Gospel of Jesus Christ, but did you know Joseph Smith took an already near perfect book of The Bible and "retranslated it" adding his own personal revelations to it including changing where Jesus was born, as to say it was a complete gospel?

He took Isaiah 29, and completely changed it... Adding the revelation that the Book of Mormon and he himself would come forth, when in the NKJV there is nothing in the NKJV about him. (From 2 Nephi 27:6 in the BoM)

Compare the JST Inspired Translation to the Isaiah Scrolls... and You will find Joseph Smith really messed up.

Here are a few more HUGE Examples of "The Prophet" changing the bible...

Matthew 6:25

KJV

- 25 Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

JST/Inspired Version (He changed this verse all together)

- 25 And, again I say unto you, go ye into the world, and care not for the world; for the world will hate you, and will persecute you, and will turn you out of their synagogues.

John 1:1

KJV

- 1 In the Beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

JST/Inspired (It stripped Christs Deity)

- 1 In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God.

Romans 4:16

KJV

- 16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

JST/Inspired (Gives humanity exaltation to become Gods instead of being saved, you'll see more as I post...)

- 16 Therefore ye are justified of faith and works, through grace, to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to them only who are of the law, but to them also who are of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
D&C Section 132

1–6, Exaltation is gained through the new and everlasting covenant; 7–14, The terms and conditions of that covenant are set forth; 15–20, Celestial marriage and a continuation of the family unit enable men to become gods.


Now, as 1 John 4:1 states

- Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

The Book tells us to try the Spirits, now... Deuteronomy 18:22 allows us to test the Prophets and not fear them should they be wrong Deuteronomy 18:20 says the Prophet who prophesizes words not spoken by God should be put to Death... Joseph Smith prophesized Christ's Temple would be rebuilt in Independence, Missouri during his lifetime, and thus it would become the NEW Jerusalem The Prophecy never came to pass.

Joseph Smith FAILED the Test of the Prophet.

Just as we tested Joseph Smith, we can also test Jesus Christ with Matthew 24:2, Mark 13:2, and Luke 21:6 in regards to the Temple in Jerusalem's destruction

Matthew 24: 2

- 2 And He said to them, “Do you not see all these things? Truly I say to you, not one stone here will be left upon another, which will not be torn down.”

Mark 13: 2

- 2And Jesus said to him, “Do you see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left upon another which will not be torn down.”

Luke 21: 6

- 6 “As for these things which you are looking at, the days will come in which there will not be left one stone upon another which will not be torn down.

The Temple in Jerusalem is NO LONGER STANDING, therefore Jesus Christ PASSED the test of a prophet.

There is a ton more I want to touch on, these "Temple Ordinances" that I am about to mention, these will creep you out...

Baptisms for the Dead - Yes, the Dead are baptized in proxy

Mormon Endowment (Do not watch unless you have an hour)

Freemason Tokens

These reasons, actually counteracted my plan, of growing closer to God, and it felt as I fell farther away than I did growing closer... So I left this religion and became a Non-Denominational Christ lover.

 

[Dionysos]

You’re a brave and strong man. I know this is important to you as you had considered yourself on a spiritual journey, found a new place to belong, and I know you were fond of your mentor.

Don’t worry. Your journey has not ended. Your time with Mormonism can be looked upon as one stretch of that journey.

Personally I don’t trust holy books which have been compiled and edited by men. Men and women can’t be trusted with these things because they exploit people (not always intentionally) by claiming the endorsement of god/s for their own agendas. Maybe by stripping away the edits of mankind you can get closer to God, and by opening yourself to all people you can be closer to people (though I don't practice religion myself). I hope that becoming non-denominational and more open might be a good step. Good luck.

 

[NeroTrinityX]

You’re a brave and strong man. I know this is important to you as you had considered yourself on a spiritual journey, found a new place to belong, and I know you were fond of your mentor.

Don’t worry. Your journey has not ended. Your time with Mormonism can be looked upon as one stretch of that journey.

Personally I don’t trust holy books which have been compiled and edited by men. Men and women can’t be trusted with these things because they exploit people (not always intentionally) by claiming the endorsement of god/s for their own agendas. Maybe by stripping away the edits of mankind you can get closer to God, and by opening yourself to all people you can be closer to people (though I don't practice religion myself). I hope that becoming non-denominational and more open might be a good step. Good luck.

Thanks Dan, most of my spiritual journey is to become closer to God, not become god. And as for my mentor, he understands why I left.

 

[ZaXo Ken'Ichi]

This sort of thing is why I personally long since abandoned Catholicism, which was the faith I was born under. While I'd always had questions that seemed difficult for others in the religion to answer, I generally had no reason to question my place in it as a whole. Then one day, a friend of mine who was part of some sort of Christian faith, was talking about how he couldn't hang out after school, because he had to go door to door trying to convert and 'save' people. He said that anyone outside of his religion was damned to hell, and that he was too, if he didn't at least attempt to 'save' them. This felt wrong to me on a multitude of levels, not the least of which was that it felt more like a marketing ploy -a way to keep his local church up and running- and less like a genuine want to help people.

That sort of opened my eyes to the fact that any sort of faith -including non-faith- can try to manipulate people in ways that I just can't personally agree with. But more-so, I began to learn where a lot of the 'longstanding traditions' in faiths similar to mine had come from. Most of the time, rules were changed to suit whatever countries/cultures within which that religion was powerful at the time; and usually it was a way to maintain power, since the churches were in control of a lot of aspects of various governments. Things like homosexuality weren't always against faiths like Catholicism; they were added in specific time periods to shape societal ideals.

What that showed me is this: Regardless of whether any organized religion is inherently good in some ways, or bad in others, too much of it was man-made, and could not be trusted as the words of a God. Anyone with power within the faith can change what they deem fit, and there is not enough proof for me that these people have any real connection to any God(s). Many of them have in fact shown the opposite, by quietly committing what would be considered egregious sins by their faiths. So why should I trust that they can guide my faith?

So I've long since abandoned organized religion in favor of just believing what I want to believe. I choose to believe that there's a truly benevolent God (or Gods), because I'd rather spend eternity in hell than support a deity who would damn people simply because of their sexuality, or the color of their skin, or their reluctance to pedal belief systems as if they're used cars, etc. Believing in some sort of honest, kind, all powerful being that doesn't pick favorites just feels right to me, even if science thinks it can disprove the existence of such a thing. The details aren't important to me; I don't care whether it's one God, or tons of Gods, or whether they've meddled or anything, as long as they're unwavering in their understanding, protection, and forgiveness for those that deserve it.

That being said, I still very much value science and knowledge rather than myths written in books. Whether the stories in any bible are true has no bearing on what I choose to find important. And I think it's a shame that people get so caught up into such semantics, as to start wars and spread hatred over it. I think a strong moral foundation is still the most important thing, and that can sometimes be found in faith. But it can also be found elsewhere. I don't care what anyone else chooses to believe, as long as it doesn't harm anyone else. Because in the end, I believe that we were put here for no other reason than to enjoy life, and to try and leave this world at least a little better off than we were born into it.

So in other words, you're far from alone in trying to find a path of your own. And you're far from the only one to question aspects of your faith To get cheesy for a second, I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said "Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.", which at least for me, couldn't ring more true.

 

[NeroTrinityX]

So in other words, you're far from alone in trying to find a path of your own. And you're far from the only one to question aspects of your faith To get cheesy for a second, I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said "Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.", which at least for me, couldn't ring more true.

When it comes to my faith, there are those who think if you question it... then you're committing apostasy.... I began to question it, and thus they refused to answer questions... which led me to searching for answers myself. I found the answers, which I didn't like, so I prayed on it. I felt the spirit return when I began talking to a Non-Denominational Pastor who came to my house, who said he would help me in my conversion to christianity... I told my bishop that I was leaving the LDS...

He said okay... 2 hours later, I get a call from the Stake President which I was informed that I was being charged with apostasy through deciding to join another church while being a member of the Latter Day Saints...

They had the missionaries call me to change my mind, and I said I didn't believe Joseph Smith was an actual prophet, to which the missionaries hung up... Another hour later I get another call from the Stake President, and ANOTHER charge of Apostasy through doubting the validity of Joseph Smith.

I get told, because I have two charges of Apostasy, which means I'm told I wouldn't be able to partake of the sacrament, and I laughed... for that, I got told I have a "Court of Love" hearing come up... I laugh, and I'm told I'm facing ex-communication.

At this point, the Pastor of my new church was still at my house, and said that quitting the church was the best thing.

 

[AuronX]

I absolutely agree with you, NeroTrinityX , and it's frustrating at times because I know a number of Mormons whom I greatly respect as people, but there are too many inconsistencies and practices in Mormonism that I just can't subscribe to to accept their beliefs. And questioning things is always good--any religion that can't stand up to you thinking for yourself can't be the truth. Personally, I do a lot of thinking. And questioning. And in my experience, nothing has been able to hold up to all of it but the Bible itself. Not Catholicism or any particular protestant denomination (although I don't disagree with the idea of denominations)--just the part God wrote himself. Historically, scientifically, logically, it's just the only thing that makes sense. People will disagree with me on that--and that's fine, they're as free to think for themselves as I am--but I don't say that lightly. I've traveled places, seen original documents, learned Hebrew. I've put more time and energy into challenging my own beliefs than most other people will ever put into challenging my beliefs, and this is where I've ended up.

But that sort of approach isn't popular, even on a smaller level--as you're now discovering. It can feel uncertain and isolating at times, but the worst thing you can do is stick to something you don't really believe in--although many people do, just to maintain the status quo. What you're doing makes you a rare breed, and that's a good thing. Thanks for sharing your journey with us

 

[NeroTrinityX]

I did post this on my personal facebook in regards to what's going on...

le sigh... I know people are saying that I should listen to the holy spirit... I am listening to the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit does not dwell in places of danger, and to be honest... The past few weeks I've not had the holy spirit with me in that building... However, when I am around people I know, and enjoy talking the bible with I do feel the spirit. I don't even need to speak about Christ with certain people to feel the gifts that the Holy Spirit gives, because the Holy Spirit dwells in places of happiness no matter what religion you are.

I'm going to say this once, and ask that I be left alone about it, I left the Latter Day Saints because I take issue with the TEACHINGS, and ORDINANCES not the people (Outside of Joseph Smith, and a lot of people know how I feel about him...)

You guys can say that I should listen to the holy spirit, I am listening to the Holy Spirit... Because I feel it, and this is my true testimony that says how Christ got to my heart... it took me THIRTY YEARS OF MY LIFE to realize that Christ didn't care about what religion we are, Christ cared about US. He died on the cross for US, not for us to label or separate ourselves based on how we want to worship him...
I'm NOT leaving the Lord or Christ, I'm just changing the way I worship them, I feel like I don't need a second book, I feel like a great knowledge of understanding of the Father and Son through the bible is all I need.

What I ask, is that my decision to disassociate myself with Religion in of itself to be respected... I'm not leaving God, or Christ, just removing the religious labels that I put on myself...

 

[mothcorrupteth]

I'd been meaning to comment on an earlier post you made on this subject, but I own that my mind is fresher on apologetical questions related to political issues and philosophical behaviorism. I've not really touched Mormonism in the last 8 years beyond watching Big Love, and memories fade with nonuse.

I'm on surer footing when I speak of leaving manipulative groups, because I've done it. What you go through right now is very difficult. There will be many an atheist cheering you on to go further and question more, and you'll appreciate the sympathy but the outright rejection of God will leave you uneasy. You will cut ties--or rather your ties will be cut for you--with people you came to know and trust closely, people who formerly felt like safe havens in your life. You will doubt yourself and your new religious peers at times, perhaps even suffer panic attacks under the pressure. Some people who go through what you are become depressed and contemplate self-harm and the feeling of self-doubt becomes even more torturous because of the Christian doctrine against suicide. I hope that's not the case with you, but you should be prepared for that possibility and monitor yourself, your thoughts and your emotions, for those kinds of feelings. Seek professional help if you find yourself considering self-harm.

If you know anything about theology, you know that I, as a Calvinist, am glad to hear the direction you're moving in. Checking what you believe against the objectively verifiable teaching of the written Scriptures is the core of good theology. Following every little feeling you have more often breeds trouble, though there is a place for trying to interpret the Providence of God through the events that He unfolds. As glad as I am, though, I would caution you to be careful about your next steps. A disclaimer: I'm not a counselor. I'm a behavior analyst who has taken continuing education units related to counseling, as well as an experienced Reformed Presbyterian who has talked more than a few friends through their problems. And what I would advise here is that this Non-denom pastor said some right things at not quite the right time.

It's true that you're probably better off leaving the Mormons voluntarily in one quick motion instead of dragging it out. However, in my humble opinion, it was pushy for the pastor to tell you so soon after that emotionally charged phone call that you were making the right decision. The Apostle Paul writes (Rom. 14:23) that "whatsoever is not of faith is sin." What Paul means in context is that some veteran believers who have realized that they don't have to continue following Jewish dietary law might be seen eating unclean foods by younger believers who feel in their own consciences that it's wrong to break Jewish dietary law. When this happens, they might eat out of peer pressure instead of out of the belief that it's actually okay. And that subjective violation of conscience is sin, Paul says. What I mean for your case is, take things slowly. Like I said, I think you ultimately are making a good decision, but make sure it's your decision. I'm not making any accusations or assumptions about the Non-denom pastor; I'm only suggesting that I think he made a mistake in that one instance. And in light of that, I'm also suggesting you watch to be sure you don't jump into any decisions because of pressure.

There is an often misunderstood letter by John Calvin to (I believe) the Reformers of Bern in which he cautions them not to ban the celebration of Christmas. The letter is often misunderstood by Reformed and Presbyterians who wish to defend the celebration of Christmas, because they miss the context of Calvin's statements. Specifically, in another part of that letter, Calvin says that he himself would not have banned Christmas in Geneva, but that he was glad to find that the city rulers had decided to do so anyway. The reason is, Calvin didn't see any biblical basis for Christmas and thought it shouldn't be celebrated. But he realized that trying to make that happen all at once was probably going to cause a riot and result in everything he'd worked for to that point being ruined. It's kind of the same thing with spiritual growth on an individual scale. Take it slowly. Take it carefully. Don't try to do everything at once. Make sure your basic psychological needs are being met before taking steps that you're not feeling ready for.

And know that you have support from other people.

 

[NeroTrinityX]

Day 1 went great at my church, little did I know that my church also filmed for TV! I had a blast though!

 

[NeroTrinityX]

Massive Update anyone? I've officially registered my resignation to the Mormon Church... My new church is The Living Word, the pastors have really have taken to me at the church! One of them sees I have a great understanding of the Holy Bible (NKJV) and every day they call and check on me. In fact earlier today (Yesterday East Coast and above) I was baptized by water, the lessons I took the church, and the feeling I got when I spoke to the pastors made me feel the true gift of the holy ghost return. And with this, my testimony returned, and this new testimony feels really powerful.

I full heartedly believe God is our Heavenly Father who wants us to be closer unto him, Jesus is our savior born of a virgin who died on the cross to atone for our sins, and when he died on the cross, the temple tore the veil putting an end to a need for Prophets, Temples built of rock. "It is finished" truly did put an end to the Mosaic Law. I also know that through testing the spirits, and prophets God has shown me what is true, and what is false and thus he gave me a great discernment to know which is a true prophet and which is a false.

 

[Shu]

Sorry for being a little late on this. I know coming from myself being an agnostic, it's a moot point, but I honestly think you are doing a great thing here. I am not against people having something to have faith in, in fact I think that's some of the reason people keep striving to grow spiritually. I'm spiritual in a sense, but I find it hard to back everything with an organized religion.

I think part of evolution of a single entity is changing and adapting period. I think some religions don't have the ability to adapt, but only give a foundation to start with. I think with what you are going through is only one stage of your evolution. The next is to figure out what keeps you grounded and rooted. Just remember part of any religion, you need some sort of backbone to give you answers to your own questions.

If you feel your energy is lacking due to some artificial rule a man wrote, then find your own way. Not every rule / measure fits every living organism. We all adapt in our own way. If you believe in the 1 => All => 1 approach where everything was started as one organic matter, and that overtime all divided, but in the end all will be at one, then there is a chance you will try to do all in your power to benefit this.

If you believe in organized religion where a church / mosque / temple is a place to worship, then no one is stopping you from joining this community. Just remember, think for yourself and if you have to question it.. then make sure you get your answer. Faith is the hardest adaptable measure on this one big ole planet. No one has all the answers, but through wisdom and additional experience one tends to "understand."