Do you think its possible to self-teach (with online resources and books) web design and programming? I don't want to waste my time to much but I'd love to know how to do it. I mean its a lengthy subject so what I'm asking do you think there are enough FREE tutorials online which will give me enough info on how to do this to a high standard, or am I being to ambitious, as people go to university for this kinda stuff.
Tech Teaching myself web design and programming?
- Thread starter Del Boy
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Most people learn online, we did a module on it last year and were effectively just turned loose
The best place to start is w3Schools
http://www.w3schools.com/html/default.asp
The best place to start is w3Schools
http://www.w3schools.com/html/default.asp
Twilight Sky
Blue Mage
Yes you can. Many people did this during the golden age of webdesign in the late 90s. It's not as popular anymore, but the ability to teach yourself is ever present.
MASTER NINJA'D
MASTER NINJA'D
Yeah been using ww3 schools and I'm shocked at the really in depth content they have, and its all free.. I've only really started today and I can atleast write a basic html script knowing the tags of by heart so I thank you for the link! will continue to learn it and see where it takes me.
DarkXShadowX21
Chocobo Breeder
Not the greatest place to go....I am going to school for my B.S. of Science in Mobile Development. W3 is outdated and using code that doesn't work well anymore. I would stay clear away from that website at all costs...
Here are some better resources for you when it comes to programming and design. These websites will get you on better track for what you are wanting to learn. Good luck!
http://www.webplatform.org/
http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/1-introduction-to-the-web-standards-cur/#toc
https://developers.google.com/university/
http://reference.sitepoint.com/css
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs
https://kuler.adobe.com/#themes/rating?time=30
http://docs.kendoui.com/getting-started/changes-and-backward-compatibility
http://jquerymobile.com/
http://jqueryair.com/
W3 schools has plenty on HTML5 now and it clearly highlights any code which has become deprecated, it is still the best intro to programming web pages you'll find anywhere.
DarkXShadowX21
Chocobo Breeder
I beg to differ on this statement. It being not as popular is not even close to being true. Web design and Mobile development fall hand in hand with one another. The career of web and or mobile programming these days makes more money than what your average doctor brings home on his salary. More and more people are more interested in learning the tools of the trade because of the numerous amount of jobs you can do with just knowing those 2 fields alone.
There are plenty of other sources that are free that have much more valuable information on web and mobile development protocol. I've learned quite a lot about w3 from the private university I attend. I wouldn't just suggest the idea that w3 was no good for no reason. I work with people who have been programming for many years and teach the most up date programming that have mentioned that w3 is no good for several reasons as compared to the others that are out there. I have learned quite a lot from the people I work with and I'm just helping with some advice that has been passed down to me for everyone on here to take into consideration and appreciate.
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PHP, which is basically what allows you to have users log in and things like that. Or call things from a database, store things in a database etc.
By learning (X)HTML, CSS, Javascript/Ajax and PHP, you should be well on your way towards making websites professionally. Remember, though: There's more to a website than code. Unless you've got a graphic artist handy, you're going to need to be at least somewhat artistically-talented in order to pump out websites that clients are going to want to pay for. This also lends weight to the expression "anyone with access to Photoshop considers themselves graphic artists." Don't start making websites for other people until you think you're ready, because all it takes is one bad review and you may not be able to crawl out of the deep, dark abyss.
Lynda.com also has excellent video tutorials on virtually anything to do with computers and business. It's not free, but you may be able to find somebody with the videos who's willing to send them to you.
Also, you may want to look into software such as Drupal, WordPress, and vBulletin. Those are popular.
Lynda.com also has excellent video tutorials on virtually anything to do with computers and business. It's not free, but you may be able to find somebody with the videos who's willing to send them to you.
Also, you may want to look into software such as Drupal, WordPress, and vBulletin. Those are popular.
http://css-tricks.com/
Is an excellent way to make good looking sites via code without having to be a graphic artist
Is an excellent way to make good looking sites via code without having to be a graphic artist
much more popular, yep. web design and mobile development don't really have any more of a connection than web design and desktop development. maybe you'll make a packet if you're a senior designer/developer or you're with a well established company, however there aren't enough jobs to fulfil the dreams and desires of every person who decides they're an expert designer/programmer/whatever else they want to call themselves. couple that with the fact that just about anyone can get a degree in most subjects and you're not looking at that dream salary anymore sonny!
some lovely stuff there centred around mobile development but strangely enough you've linked articles from several browser providers and i dont have a clue why you've included telerik's kendo ui. it's a great jquery framework but i doubt anyone would want to pay $400 for it when they're just starting out learning. w3schools is a great way to learn the basics of web development, some of their tutorials are outdated in the sense that they aren't selling the latest and greatest as something that works in all browsers and is standards compliant, but once you've got the basics it's up to you to keep up to date.
that one is shit. what you want is something that's browser specific and costs a small fortune.
the point is that if you have the dedication you don't necessarily need to spend any money at all. you can spend money on subscriptions to magazines, college courses, uni courses etc etc and still half arse it because you dont want to put in the effort.
Personally, I dropped $14,000 on post-secondary education for web development, and I've learned on my own without a teacher, so I have a little experience in both fields. If I knew of an incredible free alternative to schooling back then, it would have saved me a lot of money. We can't forget what I paid for Photoshop while in school. Yes, I actually paid for Photoshop. Hard to believe somebody actually did that, yeah? xP
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It really depends on the tactic you want to take. The reason programming is even offered in college is because they believe they have the best route of classes to get you trained in a specific amount of time. I will say one thing that might blow your mind. College only prepares you 20% of the way. From the MYSQL or Oracle you have to take. The Java, C++ or C you pick up, you have to adapt to modern day code which is beginning to be C# only it seems.
The main things you will find taxing is client side and server side load. How much do you want to put on the DB objects, and how much do you want the client side to handle (ajax, xml handling, and such). The chief objective to learning is not only just to put a website out there, but to make it fast and snazzy. Programmers are not designers in my opinion and designers are not programmers. They should never mix and mingle, due to how much time both take especially in an extreme programming environment. Styling is an art. Graphics design is also an art. If you know HTML that doesn't mean you are a good designer by default. You have to know what colors match with what, and you also have to know how to create your own graphics in my opinion.
If you are looking for object oriented programming I can suggest a few things to get you started, but I will say the real difference between code really is syntax. Once you learn one as far as functions, data types, arrays, threading, and data layers (Database) - you should easily be able to adapt to other language.
Though if you want to learn functional programming, you must truly LOVE programming. A lot of functional programing has to do with algorithmic patterns and such. It is very VERY taxing if you don't know what you are doing. If you really want to learn functional programing, I would start with Scala. I know of a few free classes you can take online to receive certificates: https://www.coursera.org/course/progfun . Next fall I'm sure they'll offer the class again.
I would start with either Ruby/Python and then work your way towards java. That's just my opinion. Java will make you learn how to use Loops, Multi Dimensional Arrays, and the ends and outs to just about every data type. You need to learn memory management before java, that's why I mentioned functional programming.
I would then say.. see what you can do with C# or C++. These are both excellent languages of modern day. I don't consider VB one due, to it will be outdated one day and in my opinion no longer supported.
Now let's talk about design. HTML and styling and java script. If you know javascript you can learn JQUERY which will help big time for different events. Accordian events and Tabs are huge these days when dealing with design. Though in my opinion I would REALLLLLY get to know your HTML. It's essential for knowing positioning, height, length, borders, padding, and different object types.
Let's say you took HTML and wrapped it around ASP.net or PHP. Well without html, your controls in ASP.net will be templates. You will not have a clue how to make a Grid or table a certain amount of cells. With HTML and CSS, you can wrap each of the controls inside of class names which make it easier for managing the styling and such. Say if you have 40 buttons, but you wanted them all to look and act the same. Well with Jquery and CSS you can style it and handle the events. Same thing with labels, text boxes, grids and etc.
The last thing and the most important thing is.. pick up some Database knowledge. While it's not SUPER important, the thing about it is you need places to handle all your data. Trust me, you don't want to work with Note pads, excel sheets and such forever. You need to be able to code dynamically. Look up some MYSQL for this. You need to know how to query, how to insert/update/truncate/delete. You need to know how to pull dates, how to order by, how to group and one day learn more advanced.
For SQL since I am heavy into it..
I would start off learning like this:
1) Learn your syntax and data types. From Varchar, to Int, to DATETIME, to all of the others.
2) Learn how to do a select query. SELECT [Column Names] FROM [Table Name] WHERE [Condition] ORDER BY [COLUMN] asc or desc
3) Learn how to do complex select queries with Joins.
4) Learn how to use functions in select queries to take out Nulls, select by max, do counts and such.
5) Learn update queries.
6) Learn how to insert.
---
7) Learn how to build a table.
8) Learn how to build a function.
9) Learn how to use triggers.
These are just the starting areas. Later on you can learn about common table expressions, primary keys/Foreign Keys, indexes and such.
The main things you will find taxing is client side and server side load. How much do you want to put on the DB objects, and how much do you want the client side to handle (ajax, xml handling, and such). The chief objective to learning is not only just to put a website out there, but to make it fast and snazzy. Programmers are not designers in my opinion and designers are not programmers. They should never mix and mingle, due to how much time both take especially in an extreme programming environment. Styling is an art. Graphics design is also an art. If you know HTML that doesn't mean you are a good designer by default. You have to know what colors match with what, and you also have to know how to create your own graphics in my opinion.
If you are looking for object oriented programming I can suggest a few things to get you started, but I will say the real difference between code really is syntax. Once you learn one as far as functions, data types, arrays, threading, and data layers (Database) - you should easily be able to adapt to other language.
Though if you want to learn functional programming, you must truly LOVE programming. A lot of functional programing has to do with algorithmic patterns and such. It is very VERY taxing if you don't know what you are doing. If you really want to learn functional programing, I would start with Scala. I know of a few free classes you can take online to receive certificates: https://www.coursera.org/course/progfun . Next fall I'm sure they'll offer the class again.
I would start with either Ruby/Python and then work your way towards java. That's just my opinion. Java will make you learn how to use Loops, Multi Dimensional Arrays, and the ends and outs to just about every data type. You need to learn memory management before java, that's why I mentioned functional programming.
I would then say.. see what you can do with C# or C++. These are both excellent languages of modern day. I don't consider VB one due, to it will be outdated one day and in my opinion no longer supported.
Now let's talk about design. HTML and styling and java script. If you know javascript you can learn JQUERY which will help big time for different events. Accordian events and Tabs are huge these days when dealing with design. Though in my opinion I would REALLLLLY get to know your HTML. It's essential for knowing positioning, height, length, borders, padding, and different object types.
Let's say you took HTML and wrapped it around ASP.net or PHP. Well without html, your controls in ASP.net will be templates. You will not have a clue how to make a Grid or table a certain amount of cells. With HTML and CSS, you can wrap each of the controls inside of class names which make it easier for managing the styling and such. Say if you have 40 buttons, but you wanted them all to look and act the same. Well with Jquery and CSS you can style it and handle the events. Same thing with labels, text boxes, grids and etc.
The last thing and the most important thing is.. pick up some Database knowledge. While it's not SUPER important, the thing about it is you need places to handle all your data. Trust me, you don't want to work with Note pads, excel sheets and such forever. You need to be able to code dynamically. Look up some MYSQL for this. You need to know how to query, how to insert/update/truncate/delete. You need to know how to pull dates, how to order by, how to group and one day learn more advanced.
For SQL since I am heavy into it..
I would start off learning like this:
1) Learn your syntax and data types. From Varchar, to Int, to DATETIME, to all of the others.
2) Learn how to do a select query. SELECT [Column Names] FROM [Table Name] WHERE [Condition] ORDER BY [COLUMN] asc or desc
3) Learn how to do complex select queries with Joins.
4) Learn how to use functions in select queries to take out Nulls, select by max, do counts and such.
5) Learn update queries.
6) Learn how to insert.
---
7) Learn how to build a table.
8) Learn how to build a function.
9) Learn how to use triggers.
These are just the starting areas. Later on you can learn about common table expressions, primary keys/Foreign Keys, indexes and such.
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Twilight Sky
Blue Mage
I meant, stuff like fan sites and the like. Things that were not done for money but more of expressing ourselves.
DarkXShadowX21
Chocobo Breeder
Thank you for going much further in depth about programming. I was thinking about going further in depth about it since I have the experience to be able to do so. I just wasn't sure how deep this thread was going to take it.
On a side note:
This may be true to most of the types of schools that are out there. The one I attend on the other hand teaches a much better of understanding of programming and design that will expand your knowledge and creditability to be used for getting into a career. This degree earns your a Bachelor's of Science in Mobile Development and it's a 32 month program. I must say, it's well worth the time and investment.
The only opinion I have on this statement is that it may be true for some but not everybody. I am one of those kind of people that have a passion for creating digital art as well as programming. I am very decent at both and I enjoy putting in the time into both types of work.
As far as everything else you mentioned. Thanks for the in depth explanation from your point of view. Very well said. I am glad to see fellow programmers on this site.
Lynda.com is fantastic. My university provides with with full access to Lynda throughout our entire degree. I have learned quite a lot from just Lynda alone. Plus, if you aren't willing to go to school, Lynda is MUCH more cost effective than paying college tuition.
This all depends on what you are passionate about. Just because I am at a university learning how to specialize in programming and designing doesn't mean I'm an expert. A lot of people make the mistake of "Knowing Photoshop" and "Knowing how to create an html tag/page" and call them selves a designer/programmer. That's the problem with this line of work honestly. The people who really make it are the ones who are going above and beyond to dedicate them selves to what they can do with these types of skills as a professional. Hard work and dedication pays off in the end and that is what's important.
That wasn't my quote...Lol
The links I provided were only to be used as reference in a generalization. I used mobile development resources because that's where the industry and marketing is leaning towards. Kendo ui is a great source indeed. Some people would pay $400 to educate themselves.
Gotchya!
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that was my point. everyone on the internet is an expert now. and lots of people will get the "best" degree. a lot of the graduate schemes rely on the gift of the gab and how capable you are of working in a team. passion isn't enough, in fact it probably isn't even that important if you want to get the dream job with the disgustingly large salary.
kendo is great. though the telerik support has a lot to be desired (imo). the only thing you'd be educating yourself on for that $400 is kendoui. one jquery framework. it would be more helpful to start with jquery documentation. the industry has always leaned towards applications that dont care what they're running on so that we can all play with the latest tech toys.
kendo is great. though the telerik support has a lot to be desired (imo). the only thing you'd be educating yourself on for that $400 is kendoui. one jquery framework. it would be more helpful to start with jquery documentation. the industry has always leaned towards applications that dont care what they're running on so that we can all play with the latest tech toys.
DarkXShadowX21
Chocobo Breeder
Without passion you don't have motivation to push yourself to create something new and innovated. There's nothing wrong self gratifying your self in a sense where motivation is pushing you achieve your dreams. Nothing is impossible.
Very true.