Crisis Core Did you cry? Were you moved?

[Serah]

Excuse me dear, was that supposed to be an insult? I'm sorry, but I just found the way you chucked a little spaz about Crisis Core's ending, rather humorous. If you'd like spark intelligent discussion, I suggest you be careful because people do tend to get to defensive over their favorite games and we have quite a lot of members who rather enjoyed Crisis Core or Crisis Crap, is what you called it I believe? Regardless, these little tiny things tend to lead to instigating and flame wars. But just for argument's sake, I'll pick apart your post.

I cried-- because it was terrible.

Just curious, why would anybody cry over a game being terrible? If you hated it that much, why didn't you just put it down and walk away from it?

One of the many, many things that made Final Fantasy VII so revolutionary was the death of Aeris. Not only that she died, but the way that she died. It was unexpected, cold.

Yes, but it was also difficult to really get a feel of everyone's full emotions. It was very fast, unexpected and hard to read people's emotions through written dialogue and no facial expressions.

Looking at the relevant character development and mechanics, her removal was superbly executed. Aeris, as a protagonist, was developed on par with the other characters-- her history, dialog and relationships grew at the same pace as the others. If Square had forced her, made her overtly 'special,' manipulated the player's attachment to her, her impending death would have been much more obvious. The triangle between her, Tifa and Cloud was mid-stride-- they even gave her a final limit break.

Again I'll stress, I think readable dialogue, no voice acting and such had a lot to do with it. I don't think, even if they had made her overly special, people would've expected her to die. Take Yuna for example in FFX. Here she is this beautiful summoner, always smiling and cheerful much like Aerith. Very determined to move forward to fight what she believed in, only to be heading towards her own demise. Yet a lot of people never saw it coming until that scene during the Summoner's Sanctum where Tidus finds out her fate. It's much the same with Aerith. If the graphics were enhanced back then, people would've probably thought of her in the same light as Yuna, never knowing she was going to die, when she did it was unexpected, IMO.

There were subtle clues such as Cait Sith's fortune as well as the overworld theme but she was there-- and then she wasn't. Gone. That was that. She didn't have a chintzy, teary monolog before she died.

Originally Cloud, Aerith and Barret were going to be the only three main characters in this game. Of course there would be as Cloud and Aerith were intended to be the only original couple before they decided to bring in Tifa, create a love triangle and then kill Aerith off.

This is relevant because it made her death hit hard to the characters and the players. Everyone, in game and tangible, felt that loss and it's reality. Final Fantasy VII was a dark, dark game with limitless depth. To me, that is it's most attractive element. Aeris’ death changed everything in game from the motivation to the music. From light and optimistic to desperate and hopeless.

Naturally because everyone felt the remorse and grief from the loss of a friend, of a person they loved. Much could be said the same for Zack, except that was in Cloud's hands and it devastated him. Maybe not as much as Aerith's death devastated him, but he did view Zack as a good friend. Of course we have to remember he did take on Zack's memories and thought he himself was Zack, but that's a whole other story. Why do you think in Advent Children Cloud lives in Aerith's church and visits Zack grave? Remorse. That's what Square was trying to express through Zack's death in this game was the loss and it's reality.

This brings me back to Crisis Crap. Change what they may, the one inevitable thing, the one thing that could not be changed or distorted– Zack’s death, was. When the video started with Zack laying in the rain spattered in blood, I was so hopeful. "For the both of us... you will live." Hand on Cloud’s neck... Perfect.

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't something close to that spoken? Didn't he put his hand on Cloud's neck? Yes I believe so.

Except he doesn’t die. He goes on a twenty minute, redundant, cheesy death-rattle. When he does die, he dies smiling. If that’s not enough, when he finally shuts up and dies he starts in on a band-aid monolog again. It was as if Sqeenix does not trust it’s audience to handle profound emotion. They sugar coated it, dumbed it down. No, really guys, it’s cool. Everything is okay. Sure, dude just now full of enough lead to be an environmental hazzard, but it’s okay. He's got wings now! He's a hero! Have some closure. Have some more.

It's hardly twenty minutes...This is where I get bothered by your post here. The only thing Square was trying to do was show the connection between Cloud and Zack and the impact Zack's death would have on Cloud and the player themself. Alot of people that played this game never played FFVII either and thus had no idea Zack was going to die, so they wanted the player to really grasp and feel that impact and emotion of such an amazing character's death. It's called expressing emotion. They also wanted to show how Cloud inherited the Buster Sword. Of course it was long and drawn out (but not as long as you're saying it was). Cloud was suffering and ill. He had a hard time understanding Zack in the beginning when he first dragged himself up to Zack's body. And no...he doesn't have wings now. It was supposed to be a symbol of his passing. He did die a hero, he died to protect his dear friend as well. A lot of people longed to know more about Zack and this was what they got. I'm sorry that you think it was ridiculous, but people rather enjoyed it and didn't look at it so bitterly. The felt the torture Zack felt as he was dying and felt the suffering and pain Cloud felt through it all.

By Zack dying the way he did, I feel that it significantly took away from the legitimacy of Cloud’s character and in the most important places. I wanted to see why Cloud is so messed up– not as an observer but from his perspective. Being given that prozac ending takes the edge off of something essential and honest-- and as an end result looses the capacity for necessary empathy.

Eh? And how is that? That makes no sense at all. Cloud was sick for one and for two, before Cloud became the type of person he did, he was never like that before Zack's death and everything that happened to him. He was just an aspiring young troop, determined to become SOLDIER. Cloud even smiled and was significantly normal as opposed to his drawn in, quiet, colder character in FFVII. How can you see that it took the legitimacy away from Cloud's character? By the time FFVII rolls around, he's a completely different person believing he's Zack, remember? Then he just sort of falls into despair, losing all hope and loses himself. Once he comes back, he finds the person he is and he's back to normal, positive Cloud. (Of course until the events of Advent Children, when the grief and remorse over the loss of Aerith and Zack hit him once more.)

Just out of sheer curiosity, did you even play this game? If so, why did you play it if you think it's just a bunch of crap?

And please please watch your tone when you post towards people. Sarcasm and retaliation are not tolerated here. Thanks.

 

[Howl]

Except he doesn’t die. He goes on a twenty minute, redundant, cheesy death-rattle. When he does die, he dies smiling. If that’s not enough, when he finally shuts up and dies he starts in on a band-aid monolog again. It was as if Sqeenix does not trust it’s audience to handle profound emotion. They sugar coated it, dumbed it down. No, really guys, it’s cool. Everything is okay. Sure, dude just now full of enough lead to be an environmental hazzard, but it’s okay. He's got wings now! He's a hero! Have some closure. Have some more.

By Zack dying the way he did, I feel that it significantly took away from the legitimacy of Cloud’s character and in the most important places. I wanted to see why Cloud is so messed up– not as an observer but from his perspective. Being given that prozac ending takes the edge off of something essential and honest-- and as an end result looses the capacity for necessary empathy.

From my point of view - and I could be totally wrong - "you'll be my living legacy" was the end of it. The majority of Zack's monologue seems to take place inside of his head.
For instance, I don't think that Zack literally told Cloud "If you see Aerith, say hi for me". It seems actually, that he was thinking those things as he passed on.

 

[Serah]

Yep, Howl's right. That's what he said and then he died. Cloud cried out and all of his memories with Zack flashed before his eyes. He said very few things to Cloud at the end of that scene. Once it stopped raining and Cloud took the sword, Zack's monologue was all thought after his death. He was moving on and expressing himself one final time. This was, after all, Zack's game and not Cloud's.

 

[RioDragon]

Personally, though I haven't played Crisis Core yet, I don't see what's so all-fired emotional about a death that you knew was going to happen? It's the same thing with when I FINALLY played FFVII for the first time, I'd pretty much been leaked the whole plot by people who already played it. This took any highly emotional impact of the story away, to which I was playing the game and experiencing mostly just because I never played, but having the story leaked to me made it incredibly dull...

I expect that had to be one or two people who had the same reaction to this ending as I had to Aerith dying in VII... 'Why the f*** doesn't a Phoenix down work when it should?'

 

[Serah]

Personally, though I haven't played Crisis Core yet, I don't see what's so all-fired emotional about a death that you knew was going to happen? It's the same thing with when I FINALLY played FFVII for the first time, I'd pretty much been leaked the whole plot by people who already played it. This took any highly emotional impact of the story away, to which I was playing the game and experiencing mostly just because I never played, but having the story leaked to me made it incredibly dull...

I expect that had to be one or two people who had the same reaction to this ending as I had to Aerith dying in VII... 'Why the f*** doesn't a Phoenix down work when it should?'

The reason why it was so emotional, for me anyway, is the fight between Zack and the Shinra soldiers. That was what was most hard because this whole time you're playing the game and when you finally get there, you're experiencing everything through Zack's eyes. I'm not going to say anything more after that. All I can say is that you'll just have to play the game. I think Cloud's reaction to Zack's death is also another thing that is emotional about the ending. Not everybody knew it was going to happen either. A lot of people, as I said in my previous post, that played this game had either never played FFVII or simply forgot Zack was going to die at the end. I've heard a lot of people upset and shocked that Zack died because they didn't know it was going to happen.

 

[The Bikini Goddess]

Excuse me dear, was that supposed to be an insult?

Nope.

Just curious, why would anybody cry over a game being terrible? If you hated it that much, why didn't you just put it down and walk away from it?

You took that, and things following, literally. I apologize if my sarcasm was lost.

Originally Cloud, Aerith and Barret were going to be the only three main characters in this game. Of course there would be as Cloud and Aerith were intended to be the only original couple before they decided to bring in Tifa, create a love triangle and then kill Aerith off.

Haha, I know I'm the new kid on the block, but I'm not new to Final Fantasy. Not.at.all.

Naturally because everyone felt the remorse and grief from the loss of a friend, of a person they loved. Much could be said the same for Zack, except that was in Cloud's hands and it devastated him. Maybe not as much as Aerith's death devastated him, but he did view Zack as a good friend. Of course we have to remember he did take on Zack's memories and thought he himself was Zack, but that's a whole other story. Why do you think in Advent Children Cloud lives in Aerith's church and visits Zack grave?

Cloud lives with Tifa and together they run "Strife's Delivery Service."

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't something close to that spoken? Didn't he put his hand on Cloud's neck? Yes I believe so.

Yes it did. My point was that up until that moment, the conclusion was looking fantastic and it should have ended right there.

It's hardly twenty minutes...This is where I get bothered by your post here. The only thing Square was trying to do was show the connection between Cloud and Zack and the impact Zack's death would have on Cloud and the player themself. Alot of people that played this game never played FFVII either and thus had no idea Zack was going to die, so they wanted the player to really grasp and feel that impact and emotion of such an amazing character's death.

And that couldn't have been done without being force-fed? Zack was a great character. It would have been devastating to see him die even without the fan-fare.

It's called expressing emotion.

And please please watch your tone when you post towards people. Sarcasm and retaliation are not tolerated here. Thanks.

They also wanted to show how Cloud inherited the Buster Sword. Of course it was long and drawn out (but not as long as you're saying it was).

This was handled well in the original game. Cloud taking it off of Zack's body was much more effective, too.

I'm sorry that you think it was ridiculous, but people rather enjoyed it and didn't look at it so bitterly.

So because I'm not the status quo I'm wrong or bad?

The felt the torture Zack felt as he was dying and felt the suffering and pain Cloud felt through it all.

Wait...What?

Just out of sheer curiosity, did you even play this game? If so, why did you play it if you think it's just a bunch of crap?

So, because I don't like a game, you assume I never played it? That's a shame. I finished the game because I bought it and started it-- I bought it because I am a fan of Final Fantasy VII and was hopeful.

And please please watch your tone when you post towards people. Sarcasm and retaliation are not tolerated here. Thanks.

I apologize if you were offended. That is not my intent at all. I'm here because I want to talk openly about these games, not be outcast or taunted for voicing my opinion.

 

[BiteMe]

I can't do anything else, but agree with the Bikini Goddess on this topic.

Not everything perhaps, but on most of what she sad. I'd been nearly looking forward to the scene, it's the thing you KNOW with CC, Zack will die in the end of it. However, they made it just bah.

So I didn't cry, nor was any moved by that scene, 'cept from maybe the dissapointment, and that is slight revelutionary for me, due to the fact I cry everytime I watch the whole of ''1000 Words''. xD

 

[Tipsynaruto]

i didn't cry, but it made me feel like crap. Honestly,i haven't played FF7, but i know the storyline enough. PLus, its the way they make it and the timing of the music. Call it cheesy or what, but i guess some people are more sensitive and emotional than others. So yea, i came my closest to crying in a game (i just don't cry about games, so its more of the how-crappy-i-am-left-feeling factor)

 

[Kei]

I didn't cry I kinda liked the ending it was cool not sad, and before we even play the game I think most of us knows what the ending is gonna be

 

[Ironman]

The ending didn't really surprise me, i knew that Zack had to die, and i knew that he would have to give the Buster sword to Cloud before he did. so at the end of the game when both of these occurred i was like "I knew it!!!" with a sense of pride in my voice.

 

[jnd89]

I felt sick to my stomach, my heart was truely rippped out, so sad!

R.I.P Zack
:zack:

 

[Arcshadow]

I teared up in the ending. When Zack turns back to screen, I teared up. I was touched. Especially when that time the song was like suddenly pop-up.

 

[Vauel-Faur]

I only just saw the ending--though I've never played the game--and I have to say that it did make me a little teary. But it did make me smile when the hand reached out and pulled Zack up toward the sky, as it reminded me of the end of FFVII. Heh.

I was also extremely happy when it showed the part with Aerith taking a few steps through the slums, and then zoomed outward--but it simultaneously really bummed me out, because I'd really love for them to remake all of VII.

 

[The Illusive Man]

the ending was all in all one of the best ways they could have done it and linked together the final pieces of the ff7 series puzzle....they did a great job of making a likable hero and once again set the bar high for story telling standards...

for me FF7 would be the greatest film trilogy ever, but as long as it remains like it is...I will forever think back on it with a fond smile!

 

[Ancient]

maybe i dont have vivid emotions like some people, but i didnt really tear up. i knew that Zack was gonna get the metal money-shot from the extra scene in FFVII, but did make me feel a little sad because Zack was an unusually like-able character, with a nice story behind him, but it didnt really effect me like some people, obviously.

 

[Gwen]

I did cry a little bit at the end even though I knew what was going to happen. To me It was a good ending. I liked the song too.

 

[EVA]

Zack's been my favorite FFVII character even before AC and CC. I really didn't like how vague they were with Zack's death and how discluded he was in the original story, so I was over-joyed when the news and game of Crisis Core were released. Now, the ending I was just balling at. They explained perfectly that Zack wasn't killed by just three Soldiers (the misconception that they original game gives off), but weakened by many. I was on the verge of tears when Zack handed off his sword and such, but it's Cloud's scream that really made me crack. And the flashbacks? Augh, that was torture and it made me cry even more. Zack going up into "heaven" if you will, was where I started to calm down but the whole "Did you think I became... a hero?" thing got me started again.

Not to mention I was pretty teary for the fact that Zack was on his back to see Aerith, and then she never got to see him again after waiting for four years. Tseng saying, "Make sure you bring Zack back alive. I have letters for him... 89 of them". Oh, god. So tragic.

 

[Dimix1]

I did break into tears, One of the most heartbreaking endings in gaming history.. Sometimes i wish Cloud could of just given him a phoneix down and everything would have been okay.. It's so good of cloud in AC to put the Buster sword his dear friend gave him where he was killed.. such a sad sad event..

 

[Zentek]

Although I didn't cry, it was the sadest end of a game that I have ever played. It was bad that Zack had to die because he was a very nice person.

 

[Yondaime]

ok am i the only one thats really pissed off? zack pretty much goes through hell and back, kills his mentor etc... and ends up getting killed by some punk ass shinra infantryman???? WTF! i never even understood why exactly the army was chasing cloud and zack...was it just because they escaped from being hojos experiments??? idunno some clarification would be nice. i just cant believe that zack gets killed by some fuckin infantrymen, i mean there pussies....and hes a badass....? i honestly thought that sephiroth was gonna do it buuut guess not.

Zack died knowing his cause would end Shinra Corps. He died with his sword in his hand. While the infantryman that killed him will probably die instantly from a shot to the head, or die laying down in some bed. Or by experimentation on Hojo's part. Zack died for a cause, a mission he knew that in his heart he had to carry out. While, that infantrymen with his piece 'o shit pea shooter (LOL) was given an order and was no different than his comrades, will die one day and won't be remembered.