FFXIII-2 Worst FF yet.

[Channizard]

Yet people want another game like FFVII which was very Science fiction, and VI which again was very science fiction. The two most loved games in the series by the fans are very science fiction.

yep, FFVII was my favorite, and it was heavily Sci-Fi based. Which might bother me if the game wasn't so perfect in every other way.

While I love FFVII, my favourite FF, I gotta argue/discuss that there's nothing futuristic about it. At the time, maybe, in comparison to previous FF's it was meant to be futuristic, but it still come out very Modern.

A space program? In the Year 2000? We made it decades before they could. Canons, machine guns, and rifles for weapons? Yeah, we got that. Scientific experiments involving invitro? Yeah... well, I'm sure if we had aliens, we could do that too. Airships? Common steam punk.

There's NOTHING about VII that actually says sci-fi/futuristic. It's got an evil alien but that's about it... there's nothing hugely different than previous/future FF's which made it stand out regarding sci-fi. I DO believe it was the modern feel of it that people liked, a change, and that's why people are excited about Versus, cause it reminds us of VII.

How did Lightning come to be the one in Valhalla fighting Caius?

Lightning was written out of time as a paradox of existence. It was Etro who saved everyone and freed them from their fate as crystals/Cieth. When she did that, it created a time paradox, which is the first (supposedly) of the series to occur. This is when Yuel starts seeing changes in the future, this is when she starts dying.

Because their fate was rewritten, Lightning specifically was taken from existence.. thats why at the beginning/end, it's as if Snow and Hope don't even register that she was there. She wasn't supposed to be there.

From there, it's mere speculation that Lightning was chosen specifically for Etro as a Knight as she could possibly be the only one to fight off Caius, and to a point, this is correct. Whatever happened to her at the end will be explained in her DLC.

How and why did Noel end up in Valhalla to meet Lightning at the begining?

Just through a timegate/pulled by Etro. He prayed to Etro about changing the future and she, somewhat, granted his wish.

How and why did Noel and Caius end up being tasked with protecting Yuel?

What is it exactly that makes Yuel so special?

If Yuel dies everytime history is changed, well, how often was history being changed before Noel and Serah started messing around? 'cause it seemed like Lightning was already trying to stop Caius from exacting his master plan before they even got started.

The first time (that we can be sure of) that time was changed, was when Etro saved the group from crystal stasis. They were meant to die, but she showed mercy and let them live, so that created the first time paradox and that's when Yuel started seeing changes in the future.

Yuel's a seeress. so whenever time is rewritten, she feels the ramifications of it. It taxes on her and her body and kills her. However, as a Guardian of Time, someone has to try and protect the timeline so while she may continue to die due to paradox's, she still needs a protector. Before then, time's weren't always peaceful, and Caius even died in a battle before he was resurrected to protect her.

Every Yuel in a different timeline has a protector, and it's always been Caius. Etro saw his loyalty and gave him the heart of Chaos so that he could live forever to protect her. He wanted Noel to kill him, so that it would also kill Etro and end their eternity, but Noel wouldn't do it. So Noel wasn't ever really her guardian.


~BTW I'm not defending this game, I hate it too, I'm just answering questions.

 

[C i d]

I'm pretty sure Yeul's life is also shortened by merely seeing the future, not only by seeing a change in the future.

 

[Starships]

I have to be honest here and say that I did love and like this game. The battle system was really unique, creative and fun. And the storyline was interesting and promising.

However the more it goes on, the worse that it gets. And then the final moment is more like a bad fart than a exciting exploding ending, oh and it's a fart that smells really bad.

I disagree with you that it's the worst FF ever created. Whatever the worst FF and best FF is, is true according towards your feelings. Nothing else. Example, I think that FF12 is the worst though some FF fans believe that FF12 is the best. So wherever a FF is a good or bad is only according towards your feelings and what you prefer in a game, and a FF game in total.

Even though it has some flaws and instead of getting better it does the polar opposite, I still believe that it's ten, no eleven times better than the games that SE have been bringing out recently.

3rd Birthday, FF XIII and all. All of them are really poor games.

XIII-2 is no ways as good as FF games like FF VII and FF VI. Though it's a improvement from what SE has been doing lately. All of the last SE games have been like Square games before they brought out FF, and FF XIII-2 is like Final Fantasy.

It's not excellent imo, though compared to recent games it's pretty good. Also I love the time traveling part of the game, it reminds me of Chrono Trigger,

I don't think that Noel is a bland character. I thought that Hope was very bland though. His mature form is only getting attention from girls because he looks "hot " which is really shallow, considering they all hated his guts a couple of years ago. Noel is a warrior who has a depressing and sorrowful past, and Snow makes him incredibly angry.

Serah is no way as a interesting female lead as Terra. She was very weak and not very independent at the beginning though she gets better as the game goes along, though she still bugs me. Why didn't she go looking for her sis by herself ? Why let the man do it ? It sounds like something that would of occurred in the 1950's. The man does the work and the tough stuff, while the female is the waiting damsel, waiting at home, waiting for the man to return home.

I feel like Serah is a step backwards in FF ladies than forwards. She can battle with a bow & arrow, but she still depends on Snow & Noel, and Hope. The men.

I don't hate her character, though she does concern me. Apart from that, I disagree and think personally that the characters are pretty much OK.

XIII-2 is not a masterpiece though it's a improvement on that junk that was before it.

 

[KoRny]

thanks, I like these story explanations. cleared it up for me pretty nice

 

[Excalibur-king]

The only aspect that I do not like about this game is the fact that you can not see your enemies. What made them change this again ? In both FF12 and FF13 you could see all the monsters roaming around, and you had the chance to attack them. This vision only made the game so much better in my book. FF13-2 feels rushed in this aspect in my book.

 

[L]

even as a gamer who doesn't really care for the story, I have to say that this game disturbs me. the gameplay at least had a dramatic improvement over the last installment, but I can't say that I have ever felt more offended or that I'd wasted so much time on something after being done with it.

and apparently the proper ending is supposed to be DLC from what I hear, just to salt the wounds.

If SE wanted the bitter tears of Final Fantasy players, they sure as hell got them. But at least they didn't get my money though, fuck yeah gamefly.

 

[.Mosh]

I do and heavily don't agree with the OP on this, I own both FFXIII and FFXIII-2. I personally enjoyed FFXIII, yes it wasn't what we have had in the past or used to. I mean come on it was their first Next-Gen FF title and yes they dropped the ball a bit. Linearity and sometimes poor character development and a simplified battle system could grate on your opinion I know. But the game still had a good story in my eyes and you could forgive that game just for it's story and the FMV's alone .

FFXIII-2 came about a year later to try and improve where the predecessor let itself down. It improved the battle system to give you a sense of actually needing to swap paradigms etc, having a monster in your party to others felt tedious and problematic. Yes you only had two human characters but for me it is better to have two characters with a much greater story arc and character development, than 6 or 7 with minimal development.

I do not believe Noal and Serah are Generic, Serah herself has had a drastic makeover and she is now a character you can actually watch on screen and realise her goals and ambitions. Noal begins as a sort of monotone terminator from the future sort of role for the first like couple of hours of the game and then he really fleshes out with his relationship to Caius the main villain and Yeul who the both were to protect.

KoRny you seem to not see what this game was trying to do, as you didn't give yourself a sense of needing to do anything after the last boss you just assumed he was the hardest boss there is in the game. That is completely untrue where if you decided to do all the fragment quests, Long Gui and Yomi especially are the hardest monsters in the game, Yomi is one of the most annoying monsters to fight even when your completely maxed out. Recently in the coliseum they added more monsters that are more substantially powerful than previous. Gilgamesh is exactly who I am talking about it can turn into a 16-20 minute fight if you have no strategy at first and this is with all the best equipment and the best monsters to help you possible (At this point I can kill the last boss in like 6 minutes so to me its much improved).

The soundtrack is something I more along the lines of agree on, but some of the tunes I really do like and the heavy metal tunes I do not, but I do not let this get to me as it doesn't bother me when I am in a battle or traversing the landscape. There is incentive to do side quests, they give you fragments which in turn give you fragment skills which could help aid you grind or help locate a particular fragment you can't find or do. Or help you get that last weapon component you really need. There is also the paradox endings which sometimes show a funny take on a possible outcome that could end the story and some just plain silly but it is always something for you to explore.

And your point on classic elements is kind of poorly explained too, no towns yes that is true but FFX had no towns, it was shops and inns located in a place on your path through the story, yes their are no inns in FFXIII or FFXIII-2 but chocobocolina plays that shop role in 'locations' in which you visit. Summon abilities were removed yes, but do you remember playing FFIX and not getting to use a summon for like 2/4 of the game? I know it was a big deal to some but I didn't really mind at all. No airships yep because your travelling through time gates so of course it wouldn't FFX and FFX-2 didn't well it did as a visual aspect but you didn't fly it around like in the classics, same in FFXII just visual. It wouldn't have an open world to explore the last game to do that was FFXII and before that was FFIX, FFX didn't, FFXIII had the archlyette steppe which was fairly impressive. You have to also consider graphics compromise at the time it was the first next gen FF.

Yes the weapons looked identical with different colours and yes secret side quests were removed but some of the fragment quest get you to fight some of the toughest monsters in the game.

I agree with Valentines on the aspect of their is no best and worst Final Fantasy game, they are all great in their own unique way and each one strives to be different and sacrifices have to be made in order to change their vision whether that is a more action based battle system or a change of setting or a loss of classic features, isn't classic always in the past? Games show what technology does advancements, they bring in new features, new changes but they do their best to make it work for us 'Classic' people. Maybe we should try and develop a Final Fantasy game.....well good luck cause we can't. We ain't going to get our FFVI or FFVII or our FFIX and that is something we might have to bite our tongues about.

 

[ClaireFarron]

Characters: Ok, i agree that Noel and Serah are quite bland characters, but lightning is bad ass dude

Story: Some aspects seem very forced in this game, Noel and Serah's relationship being one in my opinion, and also most of the problems encountered by the heroes being explained away as just another time paradox that needs solving, now that just struck me as lazy.

Capturing Monster's: I did like this aspect, yes the first monsters you capture will be the only ones you need if you level them up correctly, but capturing and fighting along side a Tonberry or Gigantuar?? Now that is just cool

Post-Game Play: Viewing the alternate paradox endings that are only available after you complete the game seem like a good incentive to me.

Classic FF elements: Yeah i also agree a little with not liking the lack of towns, side quest's and secret side quests, and i would have liked optional mega hard bosses.
On the subject of sci-fi verses fantasy, the biggest selling games of the whole franchise were not in anyway sci-fi?? i rest my case

 

[kratoscar2008]

FFXIII-2 came about a year later to try and improve where the predecessor let itself down. It improved the battle system to give you a sense of actually needing to swap paradigms etc, having a monster in your party to others felt tedious and problematic. Yes you only had two human characters but for me it is better to have two characters with a much greater story arc and character development, than 6 or 7 with minimal development.

I TOTALLY DISAGREE. Final Fantasy 6 had 14 playable characters and almost all of them get developed well except for Gogo, Umaro and Mog. FF7 had all their characters well developed except Caith Sith, my point is there is no excuse for only two characters and adding monster is a lazy way to avoid make memorable characters.

 

[.Mosh]

I TOTALLY DISAGREE. Final Fantasy 6 had 14 playable characters and almost all of them get developed well except for Gogo, Umaro and Mog. FF7 had all their characters well developed except Caith Sith, my point is there is no excuse for only two characters and adding monster is a lazy way to avoid make memorable characters.

I respect your opinion, I did not mean in terms of that they wern't developed at all, I meant as in some wern't fleshed out to the extent of Noal and Serah. I don't see adding monsters is a way of avoiding memorable characters. If they planned on making playable characters I am well and truly sure they would make them memorable. They have established what characters there were in FFXIII. It didn't do a FFX-2 and tac on another woman to make it baywatch fantasy, it just thought of a new gameplay aspect which they thought people might enjoy and appreciate.

 

[kratoscar2008]

I respect your opinion, I did not mean in terms of that they wern't developed at all, I meant as in some wern't fleshed out to the extent of Noal and Serah. I don't see adding monsters is a way of avoiding memorable characters. If they planned on making playable characters I am well and truly sure they would make them memorable. They have established what characters there were in FFXIII. It didn't do a FFX-2 and tac on another woman to make it baywatch fantasy, it just thought of a new gameplay aspect which they thought people might enjoy and appreciate.

After the crapinness that was FFXIII and the Boring characters of FFXII they hell sure had to make good characters however i dint like Serah at all along with her sister at leat they are more memorable than the FFXII characters.

 

[mikeboxmad]

This game was not the worst ff game ever. this is actually my favorite ff game I have played however i do believe it comes down to personal prefrence on which ones people like and dislike

 

[L]

This game was not the worst ff game ever. this is actually my favorite ff game

im sorry but

what?

Are you sure that you've actually played any of the games in the series?

 

[mikeboxmad]

im sorry but

what?

Are you sure that you've actually played any of the games in the series?

I played final fantasy 8,10, and 13 and i honestly enjoyed 13-2 the most its just personal opinion on the ones i have played

 

[kryceks]

I never finished FFXIII. It just didn't seem to hold my attention long enough to do so. I think I played until I first arrive on Gran Pulse and then stopped.

I suppose it is not the worse game I've ever played, it just wasn't for me. I can understand why others might like it though. The production quality is really high and the plot is somewhat engaging. There was a sense of mystery and doom, but as the story unfolded it started becoming predictable. I actually only remember one character (Hope) having any type of arc. But then again, I guess it is not fair for me to judge because I didn't finish the game. So I'm not sure if any of the other characters developed more by the end.

I hear FFXIII-2 has some differences from the first and is an overall improvement. I'm not sure if I will ever play it though. These games are moving into a different direction than that of which I'm interested in.

 

[vixvicco]

Won't say its the worst one as such, but its definitley up there. I did not enjoy it much at all. Everyone says its so good and better than the previous, but honestly, reviwers nowadays must be getting paid off or something.

 

[L]

well

what do you do when an entire generation of gaming is clearly complete bullshit and you run a company centered around helping the industry thrive? If every reviewer was a realist, they would have drove this industry to the ground years ago.

Greg Street AKA "Ghostcrawler" Lead Systems Designer of World of Warcraft
On Paladins: "oh yeah, we're going to nerf them. to the ground, baby."
​

The amount of cost and effort is nowhere near the output, and most current releases always feel like there are a multitude of things that could have been easily improved upon in beta. FFXIII-2, if nothing else, is probably the best example of the sorry state of this industry right now.

Not a completely worthless game when you cut the story out of it, but the story and caius are so terribly fucking bad. It brings down the game so much, I didn't even buy the game and it pisses me off that a company can pass this shit off as a complete product without being reprimanded and then have the audacity to add some to be continued DLC shit at the end of the game.

Caius, trolling. Throw some infractions on that bitch yo. I vote permban.
​

Honestly, with some battle system improvements and a variety of endgame challenges - I could see the game not being too bad off. But no. All of the endgame challenges besides the fiends in the Archyltte Steppe and Paradox Endings (and what was speculated to be a canon story ending) are purchasable DLC.

But we didn't have this problem with Final Fantasy X, did we? Sure, no one liked Tidus and their dicks became conclave when they watched the laughing scene... but the game had a handful of endgame challenges, did not have 12 weapons that shared THE EXACT SAME FUCKING MODEL, characters with the personality of a rock (at least we know where Serah gets it from), caius or all of this dlc bullshit.

I thought it was funny. But seriously, is SE becoming the Japanese version of EA?
The company that 250 thousand consumerist readers voted worst company of 2012?
Bank of America, Paypal, USPS... and EA takes the golden poo.
I think SE would have given them a run for their money if the consumerist was not an American site.

​

 

[klauss]

I definitely agree with you that none of the characters were interesting, in that they lacked any qualities that really drew you to them (emotionally). However, I can't help but love the game, simply because of the fact that it's 'pretty'... PROFOUND, right? I know. But in all seriousness, what the game lacks in character development and story, makes up for in 'atmosphere'. In all of the Final Fantasy games that I've played so far (FFX, FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2), none of them failed to create an uplifting atmosphere that attracts you to the game. The soundtrack (of FF13/13-2), albeit; not excellent (in comparison to earlier FFs), was sufficient enough in being one of the two main components that creates the atmosphere. The other component, of course, is graphics and from Square Enix, you can expect the best. However, the graphics isn't that noteworthy in that it didn't really show me anything new. Some pretty colours here and there, but it wasn't anything out of the ordinary when it comes to SE. For instance, in FFX, being the first FF installment of the 'next gen' console (at the time) I was completely amazed by the graphics. Over a decade since its release and I'm still amazed by the amazing visuals. One of the main things that really mesmerized was the water. It was like the first time I saw water look like water in a game! And of course, the gameplay, voice-acting, story etc. was simply brilliant in FFX.

Which brings me to my main point, I feel that since FF13 and FF13-2, it appears that SE can simply rely on atmosphere alone to draw an audience. I really fear that this maybe the case, since it suggests that the FF series is going to turn to absolute horsecrap, just like mainstream music that rely on the 'glam' of music videos and auto-tune, totally disregarding all the other aspects of music that makes music, well, music. So what I'm saying is, having played FF13 and FF13-2, I feel that the artistic value of the FF series is just going to turn into one of those 'sell-out' products. I seriously hope this isn't the case. The only thread of hope left, is FF Versus 13, which I'm banking my hopes on, especially because Tetsuya Nomura said that he's directing it and being completely involved in its development. If it turns out to be another FF13/FF13-2, I'm going to cry and lose hope in the FF series.

 

[Sheechiibii]

Okay, I see a challenge to defend my opinion challenge accepted!

Characters
You say that Serah and Noel look very generic, but I disagree. I don't think they're any more generic than many other main characters in the FF franchise (youre right about the kingdom hearts thing though, I think it's the blue). Serah's clothing for starters is totally insane, as is her whole look in XIII-2 even her weapon looks pretty bizarre. She was an 'ordinary girl with a white skirt' in XIII, but not in XIII-2. I don't think a characters looks should really matter that much anyway, it's their actual personality that should matter far more and I think Noel especially is a pretty unique character. He's nothing like any FF character I've seen before, he can be light-hearted at times and serious at others, he's guarded and hurt because of his past but he doesn't mention it or moan about it all the time, he keeps it inside. He's certainly not a crybaby and neither he nor Serah struggle with their 'emo problems' they just stick in and get on with trying to sort everything out. All the way through the game I thought how different Noel was to the usual FF hero.

Story
I'm not sure I can refute you on this because you haven't actually given much examples. When do the characters come to a conclusion they shouldn't have been able to reach? I would actually say that as far as FF goes this game has one of the less complex storyline there's been. Other than perhaps X-2 and XII I can't think of any FF that has a simpler story. Etro took Lightning to Valhalla to be her protector, the timeline was changed so nobody remembered her ever surviving the fall of cocoon – so that's why and how. Yeul has the ability to see into the future so that she can lead people down the right path. She has a guardian because she's very young and her ability is something only she has, therefore she needs protecting. Noel ended up in Valhalla because Etro took pity on him when he was nearly dead and wondering around alon in his time not knowing how to change things. You see his story full circle when you go to A Dying world and see his dream of his old life, and it ends how the game begins, with Noel being taken to Valhalla by Etro.

Monsters
The monsters – well, that's your experience. Believe me, the first monsters you pick up are not the best the game has to offer, not in the slightest. All the way through the game I picked up new monsters and swapped them around. I didn't need any incentive other than wanting my party to kick ass, the same reason I level my characters up. Obviously if you level your first three monsters up far ahead they will be better than most of the others you get start out at, but that's to do with the monsters potential. They learn different abilities, they level up differently depending on what materials you use, and you can infuse monsters together to get new abilities for them. Base statistics don't mean anything much to do with the monsters potential.

Soundtrack
I liked this soundtrack a lot. Noel's theme is possibly now my favourite music from any FF it's so beautiful. Music taste, however, is not something I can defend. Everyone likes different things, so there's not much point in me trying to debate it, but I will say that all of the FF games have had some good music and some bad and some forgettable. I just soundtracks on whether there are any outstanding numbers and XIII-2 definitely has that for me.

Post-game Play
I don't have a lot of reason to play the game more, because I did almost all the side quests during the main game. A huge reason to play after the ending is to see all the paradox endings. Getting all the fragments and trophies is an achievement – the same reason why people try to max out characters in other games, try to find the best weapons and beat all the secret bosses – it's nice to feel like you've accomplished something. But the one thing that makes me want to play this game post-game compared to other games is the alternate endings.

Classic Elements
There are plenty towns in XIII-2, there's the town in Archylte Steppe, New Bodhum and the Bresha Ruins. There's the town (although deserted) in Oerba, there's the entire city of Academia. But you know one of the things I like about XIII-2 was that everywhere was different, you weren't just given small look-alike towns one after the other like in many other FF games, you got basic towns, huge cities, abandoned shacks and bases build around ruins.

This isn't the first FF not to have summon abilities either,and given that they had the monster system I don't think they needed summons as well. You don't need two sets of beasts to look after. As for the airship thing, there hasn't been an airship since FFX. FFIX if you think about it because what did the airship in X do that was different to the gates in XIII-2? And if you're talking about just in general airships being present in the plot – there was an airship at the end, you had a battle on it's roof as well.

Sure there's no actual open world to explore, but how could they feasibly do that in a game where they cross through so many different time frames? There's no way they could build an entire world for every time, and I think we get enough locations that having big empty fields to run through between each site isn't really missed. When is the last time you got to choose a party between 7-8 different characters? FFIX had 8 characters to choose from and as everyone knows when you have that many characters many do not get focus, do not get development. I'd far rather have a few characters that get proper story and development time than have a load of characters, half of whom have no purpose and a few who are just gimmicks.

They haven't done away with side quests that are only available for a certain period of time. I know this because I had to redo a whole area (and a bunch of areas to get to it) because I missed something I could only get once. (New Bodhum XX3). Also, apart from getting Fragment skills, another great reason to collect as many fragments as possible is because you need them to get the best weapon in the game, and the more fragments you have the better the weapon will be. Yes the weapons look the same, with different colours and shapes. That's pretty normal for FF – if a character has a sword they're not going to get a new weapon that looks like a gun, it's going to be another sword, with different colouring and variations etc. I think there are challenging optional bosses. I was nearly maxed out at the end of my play and I couldn't even defeat Fomoire let alone Long Gui or Immortal.

I'm not saying you have to love the game or even like it, and you're free to hate it if you want (I despise XIII and have no problem saying so whenever) but being annoyed that other people like it isn't really going to do your argument any favours. A lot of people can't understand those who like VIII, or XII. I don't particularly understand the immense love for VII, but people have different opinions and opinions are not absolute, there is no wrong or right. I'm not wrong for liking the game any more than you're wrong for disliking it.

As for the science fiction thing. Time travel really isn't that out-there as far as FF is concerned, it was introduced way back in FFVIII. The world of XIII-2 is very fantasy-like, much more so than VII or VIII's world and it doesn't have space travel like those two or IX. What makes VIII fantasy? What makes VII fantasy? You can't say 'the fal'cie and magic don't count' because you could do the same thing to many other FF games. So many Final Fantasy games have had science fiction in them, it's the mixture of that and fantasy elements that makes them different from other games.

 

[Razberry Knight]

Ok screechiibii. You basically tried to defend xiii-2 by using a mess of litttle bits of positive to make up for the bigger ones.
Characters: i like them because their unique appearance (which any character will have in FF) And unique weapons. Then you defend their personalities such as nnoel being kind hearted and not a cry baby but to me, that just dullens the character. Its why people hate zack for not really being that unique. Noel has no balance of good/bad qualities hes not that interesting and for him to be such a relevantt character? The last human being always throws me off. If it wsnone of the last, then it would sound reasonable. Overall he does have bad qualities, like Snow he also tries to be the hero in everything.

Time travel was included in the first final fantasy however it made sense in the first kne, this one just made u a story based on it but not really being relevant.

The setting of it is fantasy like and sc fi like just like its predessessor, however we still dont have a fricken clue what makes this a final fantasy xiii title. The series never holds balance and the jump between xiii and xiii-2 throws us off even more to believe any ff fan can like it.