Rinoa to Ultimecia?

[L in DHARMA]

Yeap Gaia B. sounds good but I don't share your 30-40's idea (hahaha), SQUARE could put her another clothe or different hairstyle or a little mention in the Game! (I don't remember if she said something about the witches aging)

And about GRIEVER...boy I should pass, we'll never reach a most logical theory.....

 

[Howl]

Both opinions on the griever matter make sense.

Either she really is Rinoa using Griever out of inspiration of Squall's ring, or Ultimecia is just a sorceress summoning Griever out of his mind. =]

 

[Dean Winchester]

Is not 100% that Rinoa might be Ultimacia for some reasons. First, Ultimacia is from different timeline than Rinoa, probably more than three thousand years and I doubt that Rinoa could have lived that long. Second, even if Rinoa does have a child with Squall that doesn't necessary means that her powers would be passed to her daughter, the sorceress are chosen at random, dependng on some factors like magical power, links to previous sorceress, and other facts that I don't know right now.


But there is also the possibility to think that Rinoa might be Ultimacia. Sorceress age slowly or maybe they just don't age at all. It may be possible to think that Ultimacia is just a possible representation of Rinoa being consumed by hatred and sadness. Let's say that Squall died at the ending, with both him and Rinoa lost between time. He died because Rinoa couldn't save him and then she began to hate the world and everything related to it because of the sorceress and all that. She got lost on a different timeline, probably a a thousand years into the future away from all her friends. Let's say that after losing Squall, she developed a hatred so great that changed her main reason to live.

But, then again, someone asked the big boys in Japan from Square-Enix about Rinoa being Ultimacia and they answered: "Rinoa is not Ultimacia."

Ohhh I'm tired....follow this link with some info related to Rinoa and Ultimacia, and reach your own
conclusions...
http://www.angelfire.com/games4/fantasyeight/rinoaulty.html

I posted this at another forum in which the same discussion was happening.

1. Rinoa is NOT Ultimacia. Why? Even though their faces are quite similar, you can' base your theaory on that because most characters look the same or quite similar, Duh FF Games.

2. Rinoa is NOT Ultimacia. Why? Because Ultimacia is probably a thousand years more older than everyone else from Squall's Timeline.

3. A sorcerress doesn't have to pass their powers voluntarily. Why? Because sorcerress' powers are inherited randomly as long as the choosen subject (randomly again) meets some requirements. First, Ellone could have been a sorcerress and if we think this through a lot of all this SE crap, Ellone could be a sorcerress with the ability to launch people's thoughts through time and space.

4. Ultimacia could read the thoughts of people because, when you fought her, she already possessed a power beyond that of a normal sorcerress plus adding that she was already quite powerful sorcerress.... also remember that Ultimacia was manipulating Seifer therefore she never revealed him her complete plan and also the only one who trully knew the meaning of why the SeeDs were created were both Edea and Cid Kramer, not even Squall knew that. Also, Ultimacia was using Edea's body and she need a moderate amount of energy to sustain here presence inside Edea, therefore she couldn't read people's thoughts or else she might lose control of the subject being controled.

5. The Wings mean nothing. Why? Normally every single sorcerress that was shown through the game had something similar to wings/feathers being used as decorations for their outfits. Edea, Ultimacia, Adel and Rinoa....and the many other sorceress...well the sorcerress 1, 2, and 3 that Ultimacia forces you to fight....meh

http://www.angelfire.com/games4/fantasyeight/rinoaulty.html][/url]

"Fact 9, the biggest: Now I knew myself knew that I would never believe it unless I saw that Rinoa looked like Ultimecia, and from what i could remember she didnt. However, look at these pictures I have superimposed onto one another."
Reply, the shortest: I could superimpose my face onto Britney Spears, and say we look alike, but it still doesn’t mean we do. And if you look at the picture, the only things that actually…sort of match, are the eyes and mouth. The rest of her, the facial structure and hairline (you don’t gain hair with age) just don’t come even close.
So, Jesse, I hope my friends and I helped you all out. I know coming from a bunch of Square staffers, the answer isn’t going to mean anything, so we called up the big boys in Japan and they said this: “Rinoa is not Ultimecia”.
LOL. How much more simplistic can it get.
As always, thanks for the interest, Jesse. If you have any more questions mail me.

Simple, Rinoa is not Ultimacia because the "Big Guys from Japan" said so

 

[Howl]

"Fact 6: Now this is a big indication that it is true: Rinoa 'borrows' Squall's Griever Ring. Yes, she does get Zell to make a copy, but she never gives Squall his back. This is proven at the field when Rinoa says, "I have this dream, I get all dressed up and put on your ring... etc...". Just before you enter Galbadia Garden, you get to name the ring, (The default is Griever). Ultimecia has a GF.......called Griever, (or whatever you name the ring). If you remember, you get Doomtrain out of Solomons Ring. Its possible Greiver is gained from Squall's ring, which Ultimecia would have if she is Rinoa."
Reply: This is more of an issue than Rinoa and Ultimecia being the same person. We weren’t able to come up with a reason for why the two had the same name…HOWEVER, Rinoa did return the ring. Perhaps you and your friends could write an article on this?

Didn't Rinoa offer to return the ring, and then squall says something along the lines of "you hang onto it"?


And this...

I hope my friends and I helped you all out. I know coming from a bunch of Square staffers, the answer isn’t going to mean anything, so we called up the big boys in Japan and they said this: “Rinoa is not Ultimecia”.
LOL. How much more simplistic can it get.

Is making me speculate.
How proffesional is this person anyway? Do real square staffers talk like that and leak secrets that may ruin the fanbase's appreciation of the game?

I know if FFVII's biggest secrets were released, the person in charge may have lost their job or something for christ's sake!
It totally ruins the romanticism...

 

[griever of life]

another way rinoa loves squall ultimecia hates him even if they were related like ultimecia is rinoa's great repeated granddaughter there would still be no relation, and put it this way if that bitch adel hadnt been looking for a successor none of that would have happened think about it

 

[L in DHARMA]

althought SQUARE said Rinoa is NOT Ultimecia, most of the people think Rinoa IS Ultimecia.
There exists comics and movies (for example, STAR WARS) that gets "out of control" and make its own sense and story, despite of the directors and the creators.
FINAL FANTASY VIII is an example of that. SQUARE can say anything they want, people will still believe what they think.

And that's the truly FINAL FANTASY. The indefinited thought of the story, the secrets, the possibilities. That's the MAGIC of the story.

BOOGER i'm with you! (I love your art in DeviantArt.com, I love "Leaf"!)

 

[Dean Winchester]

Sorry if this will be considered as SPAM but I have to say it due to the fact that Square Enix Staffers seem quite lazy to give a more believable answer:
.....
.......
........
"Sometimes I really hate Square Enix"

 

[21evil1]

so ppl r saying she was so consumed that she didnt recognize him?
although what shes says during the final battle is interesting.....
ill post it tommorw cuz im going to bed
​

 

[firecrotch]

I don't think she is Rinoa,
but it would have made it a little more interesting...

 

[Ryker]

I agree 100% with the Ultimecia = Rinoa theory. (http://www.rpgamer.com/editor/2005/q2/041805gm.html) This link is by far one of the most comprehensive & well-thought out compilation of the theory as a whole.

I think it speaks for itself.

 

[Jimmy]

Man not this Sir Bahamut pathetic theory again!

RINOA IS NOT ULTIMECIA!

1) Sorceresses haven´t got bigger life spans!

2) Laguna states Ultimecia lives far in the future were none of them can exist!

3) Rinoa does not have the same face lines than Ultimecia!

4) Ultimecia as a weird speech remember "Kurrrrrrrrrrrrse all SeeDs!"

5) Ultimecia is blond Rinoa as dark hair (she could have painted it but i don´t believe it it)

6) Ultimecia would have recognized Squall when she saw him!

7) The theory about Rinoa getting mad and stuff is completely pathetic

8) Sir Bahamut is a loser who could not accept other peoples points of view and failed to admit that Rinoa does is not Ultimecia!

 

[Daenerys]

Man not this Sir Bahamut pathetic theory again!

RINOA IS NOT ULTIMECIA!

1) Sorceresses haven´t got bigger life spans!

To Quote Rikku "You got proof? show me proof!"

2) Laguna states Ultimecia lives far in the future were none of them can exist!

Yes thats true - but if sorceress' have longer lifespans then RINOA would still exist - the others wouldnt but rinoa would

3) Rinoa does not have the same face lines than Ultimecia!

Watch the video in the first post again - there are quite similar

4) Ultimecia as a weird speech remember "Kurrrrrrrrrrrrse all SeeDs!"

It might be an enviromental adaptation - people change there accents over time

5) Ultimecia is blond Rinoa as dark hair (she could have painted it but i don´t believe it it)

Why not? Hair dye is a perfectly plausible theory

6) Ultimecia would have recognized Squall when she saw him!

Squall would have recognised Edea when he first saw her - yet thanks to constant GF use he didnt so the same logic can be applied to Rinoa not remembering squall

7) The theory about Rinoa getting mad and stuff is completely pathetic

How? its perfectly plausible - if everyone you ever knew and loved died and the whole world hated you i imagine youd be pretty mad too

8) Sir Bahamut is a loser who could not accept other peoples points of view and failed to admit that Rinoa does is not Ultimecia!

Childishness +1 & Hypocricy +1, calling someone a loser is hardly debating with them, and your also failing to admit that anyones theories could be correct you just keep repeating that its all rubbish over and over again.

The Rinao = Ultimecia theorie is indeed quite plausible, you just need to believe that certain things could happen and not just dissmiss them immediatly without thinking about it.

 

[Jimmy]

No Sorceresses don´t have longer life spans!

Edea gets old...she just looks young compared to Cid but nonetheless she gets old!

The theory about making Rinoa look immortal is just an invention created by those crazy Rinoa fanboys!

Rinoa would have to recognize Squall if she was Ultimecia because she was not being controlled by anyone at the time so you can´t apply the same theory as to when Edea did no recognize Squall and the rest of the team!

The video you saw about the face line resemblence between Rinoa and Ultimecia was just a joke as already the person who posted the video admited!

The game states Rinoa and everyone else cannot be alive in Ultimecias time!

Sorceresses die like any other human being there is no part in the game that shows otherwise!

As to my statements about Sir Bahamut yes they were a bit harsh but it´s the truth nonetheless back in the EOFF days he got every of his R=U threads closed because we all presented different motives to deny that theory!

So in the end it got to the simple part of a "i´m right you´re wrong!"

That´s why he was kicked out!

So...hummm that´s what i had to say.

 

[Ryker]

No Sorceresses don´t have longer life spans!

Edea gets old...she just looks young compared to Cid but nonetheless she gets old!

The theory about making Rinoa look immortal is just an invention created by those crazy Rinoa fanboys!

(); You still aren't offering any proof to back up your claim, yet you're still stating it as a fact.

Rinoa would have to recognize Squall if she was Ultimecia because she was not being controlled by anyone at the time so you can´t apply the same theory as to when Edea did no recognize Squall and the rest of the team!

But Squall & Company didn't recognize Edea either because of their GF usage.

The game states Rinoa and everyone else cannot be alive in Ultimecias time!

Which, would actually go to prove the fact that Squall & the others are dead in Ultimecia's time (i.e. Far in the future). Hence, why she's now doing what she's doing. ();

Sorceresses die like any other human being there is no part in the game that shows otherwise!

Actually, they don't die until they pass their powers or are killed. Edea explains this after she & Cid go back to the orphanage. At that point Ultimecia is no longer controlling her; since she's finally back to her senses, she passes her powers on to Rinoa in order to live out a normal life with her husband Cid.

So in the end it got to the simple part of a "i´m right you´re wrong!"

(); It's a speculative theory about a videogame. I seriously doubt there's any semblance of a "I'm right; you're wrong".

 

[Jimmy]

(); You still aren't offering any proof to back up your claim, yet you're still stating it as a fact.

But Squall & Company didn't recognize Edea either because of their GF usage.

Which, would actually go to prove the fact that Squall & the others are dead in Ultimecia's time (i.e. Far in the future). Hence, why she's now doing what she's doing. ();

Actually, they don't die until they pass their powers or are killed. Edea explains this after she & Cid go back to the orphanage. At that point Ultimecia is no longer controlling her; since she's finally back to her senses, she passes her powers on to Rinoa in order to live out a normal life with her husband Cid.

(); It's a speculative theory about a videogame. I seriously doubt there's any semblance of a "I'm right; you're wrong".

No if Squall and team are death in Ultimecias time so is Rinoa!

Dr.Odine explains there is no other way for them to reach her time unless they use Time Compression, if Rinoa was Ultimecia she would have to be a 500 year old woman or something like that...yet Ultimecia seems to be in her late 20´s or early 30´s at maximum!

If Ultimecia was Rinoa then even if she did not remember Squall and the others...i´m thinking Squall and the others would have recognized her!

Squall:"Hey you look familiar...OMG is that Rinoa!?"

Zell:"OMG it kind of looks like her but with wings and blonde hair!

Everyone else:"....What do we do now!?"

Rinoa:"....ahhh....let me stay alive and go back to the past?"

Squall and team:"ROFL no way!"

So there Rinoa is not Ultimecia because Squall and the others would have recognized her!

 

[Keeper of Time]

OK How about this; If believing the Rinoa = Ultemicia theory makes the game more enjoyable to you, believe the theory, if it dosent, dont.

For me, It made the story more enjoyable as i like plots to have more layers than an onion.

 

[Rorolina Frixell]

i tend not to because then i question everything and then boring myself out before i have finished the game

 

[TyphoonThaReapa]

A'yo, even if I seen this arguement over the internet a lot, I would have to say Rinoa isn't Ultimecia. Now, I don't have evidence to back up my opinion, but it is an opinion none the less. And, the game does not present evidence indicating Rinoa is Ultimecia. Now, general logic would tell you that if there is no evidence that she is, or that she isn't, then they are automatically labeled different people until futher notice...

 

[Ryker]

No if Squall and team are death in Ultimecias time so is Rinoa!

Dr.Odine explains there is no other way for them to reach her time unless they use Time Compression, if Rinoa was Ultimecia she would have to be a 500 year old woman or something like that...yet Ultimecia seems to be in her late 20´s or early 30´s at maximum!

Hence the proof of a sorceress' lifespan. (); Honestly, you're not really going anywhere but in a circle. Under Time Compression in Lunatic Pandora the past, the present, & the future are all the same thing.

If Ultimecia was Rinoa then even if she did not remember Squall and the others...i´m thinking Squall and the others would have recognized her!

Superman is able to put on only glasses & become Clark Kent. Miraculously, no one is the wiser.


Honestly, I'm not going to argue back & forth about a speculative theory. It's pointless. It's not too terribly difficult to see that FFVIII is a knock-off of a Greek story. But if you enjoy seeing the game as so base as not having the allusion, go ahead. For me, the story is not that transparent.

 

[Madison Strife]

hmmm ive read all the post and evidence and both sides of the story. and personally i kinda dont like the idea that Rinoa will go insane etc. and become Ultimecia. but as many have said it is plausable for either arguments as nothinb concrete has been said by the creators. now to add fuel to the fire: have anyone ever considered that it is possible that Ultimecia is a decendent of Rinoa and Squall. Even only enough generations that the story of their adventure is still retold and that a great-etc.grand daughter may have lost her knight and i dont know, somehow became Ultimecia. Just a thought....especally if the griver (sp?) ring has passed on as an heirloom.