What do YOU believe?

[Dionysos]

I believe that religion is fucking finished. It's over.

All of them have had a few thousand years to get it right, and they have failed miserably.

Take your Vatican, take your Mecca, take your God and piss off.

It's the problem with the world today, plain and simple. A blind man could see it...

I don't think religion is over. Some people need it to give their conscious a bit of a bearing. Some people need something to believe in, or some sort of explaination for why we are here as opposed to "we are here". It's an issue of maintaining mental health.

So not everyone can live, and be happy, without religion. It's flawed yes, but some people need it.



Anyway, not sure if I've actually posted in this yet. I'm not actually sure what I believe yet. I think I might fall victim to what I have just myself said, in that I'm struggling in finding a bearing with my life and wondering what the point of everything ever is and why it exists.

I was brought up Christian, but to be honest I'm just open minded. I have Greek pagan statuettes in my bedroom that I pray to on occassion (you know... just in case). And also keep Egyptian gods in my room too, though have not prayed to them yet. That's all probably just because I'm an ancient history student, but still, you never know.

I don't know what to believe, but I want to believe in something. I'm not satisfied with the scientific explaination, though it is good for telling us what happened and how for lots of things, it fails to give us purpose. Sort of reduces us all to pieces of clockwork, those of us that break should die etc. I like to think there is more to us than that, even if deep down I feel there may not be.

I'd like to believe in a creating force of some kind that started this whole thing off and watches over the universe somehow. I don't have to see things to believe them, though I don't quite believe this for sure, it sure beats the other approach to things. Such thoughts would drive me even more insane.


Goddamn that was an awful and unexplained post I just wrote. I will probably edit it and touch it up later.

 

[Ewan]

Myself, I'm a nihilist. If my eyes don't see it, basically, it does not exist to me. *shrugs* That's how I've lived my life.

gravity?
and if you're a nihilist, why not give your life meaning?

 

[Ewan]

i'm an atheist and i believe the scientific method is the most accurate way of determining the reality of our world. no one knows all the answers, but if you don't know the answer, don't substitute in the word 'god' to answer it.
my main problems with theism are:
1) which religion?
2) the despicable acts of the gods in each religion
3) the fact that your religion is largely dependent on the culture you're brought up in/the religion of your parents
it's a long list lol. i don't understand why anyone one would want a divine being watching over us either. the popular gods of today are immoral tyrants.

 

[CassinoChips]

Myself, I'm a nihilist. If my eyes don't see it, basically, it does not exist to me. *shrugs* That's how I've lived my life.

Nihilism has more to do with ethics and values, and less to do with believing in a deity. It is very possible to be a Christian nihilist or an Islamic nihilist, etc. etc. etc. In fact, one could make the argument that Christianity and other major religions necessitate that a believer adopt a nihilistic point of view.

To paraphrase the movie Dogma, I don't believe anything, but I have an idea about some things. Changing a belief is tricky. Wars are fought over beliefs. You can change an idea rather easily.

I see religion as a crutch that humans use to bridge the gap between what science currently has the capability to explain and that which is currently inexplicable. As for myself, I think I'm becoming more and more atheist as time goes by. There's just too much allegory and symbolism in supposedly 'holy' texts for me to believe that there is actually a God or gods who would really devolve him/herself to interact with us.

I don't have any problems with anyone who is religious, and I don't think that religion is a bad concept in general. Religion is fine. People who use religion to further their own means at the expense of others should be stricken with gonorrhea.

But again, my idea of religion is malleable, so this is subject to change with the introduction of new information.

 

[Valkyrur]

I'm Christian, Catholic, to be more specific.

I believe in the Holy Trinity, etc, and also believes in the events of the Bible. I'm not planning on arguing about it's realism though. Ultimately, I believe everything about religion all boils down to your own faith, belief. So, I can't say I would really view religion as a bridge for science to the presently unexplainable.

 

[Anglekos]

gravity?
and if you're a nihilist, why not give your life meaning?

Gravity can be proven. Throw a coin, and it falls back down to the ground, does it not? And the very act of seeing that coin fall back to the ground proves that there's something keeping it from rising; thus, gravity. As for my meaning of life, I do have one. *smiles* My life itself. I live for myself, and for the time being, mine alone. I don't need to search for some greater purpose, neither do I want to. I'm just a simple man with simple needs.

 

[Vladislak]

Gravity can be proven. Throw a coin, and it falls back down to the ground, does it not? And the very act of seeing that coin fall back to the ground proves that there's something keeping it from rising; thus, gravity.

Is that coin falling straight down?

Your eyes deceive you. In truth it falls in an arc, keeping the velocity of the earths rotation. Because you are rotating as well it just appears to fall straight.
If it were to fall directly down in a straight line without considering the rotation of the earth, then you would drop an object and it would appear to fall down and move away from you. Which is ridiculous.

Now, this may have no consequence on whether gravity can be proven, but it demonstrates that using your eyes alone is foolhardy. And that is what your original argument was, was it not?

If my eyes don't see it, basically, it does not exist to me.

Now, onto another closely related argument: Many centuries ago, mankind understood a great deal of things, but not the forces behind them. Before the discovery of atoms and electrons, there was no "proof" of their existence. Nobody could prove it, therefore they did not exist to the people despite the effects they have on their everyday life. Atoms and electrons were all around them, affecting nearly everything they did, and yet they were ignorant of them.

In light of that, any concept and notion is plausible even without definitive proof. We could discover tomorrow that everything we've ever known about chemistry is false, and only worked for us because of minor accuracies in the theories behind chemistry.

You could say "that's ridiculous, we know chemistry works in the way we discovered it, it's fact not fiction!", and you might just be repeating the same mistake people made when someone came forward and proposed that the world was round and not flat. Everyone at that time "knew" the world was flat, and that it was foolish to think otherwise. But everyone was wrong.

As I said: any concept or notion is plausible. That includes religion. It's all about keeping an open mind.

 

[Seed]

I'm a Protestant, but I believe in evolution.
Not macroevolution, microevolution.
I believe that God created all things, human and animals,
and I believe they evolve within their own species, not into new species.
For example, a bird may have great great grandbirdies (what's a baby bird called? lol) that have longer beaks or wings or whatever than he did.
Whatever they need to adapt and keep surviving in that area.
Not that a monkey evolved into a human, or any macroevolution like that.

 

[mothcorrupteth]

I am a Calvinistic, Orthodox Presbyterian Christian.

What this *does not* mean is that I follow John Calvin (actually, I like Luther's writings better) or that I think that those who disagree with Calvinism aren't Christians (this is a Hyper-Calvinist teaching) or that I subscribe to Augustinian political theory (and those who think that Calvin promoted institutional theocracy *cough*Sam Harris*cough*Dave Hunt*cough* seriously need to brush up on their scholarship).

It *does* mean that I believe in double predestination, i.e. that God is sovereign in all things which come to pass -- which should be the foundation not only for the Christian's comfort, but also for the confidence with which he engages the world in the theatres of business, economics, politics, and science. This is what is meant by "Calvinistic."

It also means that I believe that the group that is now known as the Presbyterian Church, USA, has, like nearly all the other major denominations in Europe and America, abandoned the founding principles of Protestant religions and traded the moral integrity and intellectual inspiration of the Reformation for the cheap parlor tricks and sophistry of revivalism, mysticism, and the plain ol' fuzzy-wuzzies. This is what is meant by "Orthodox."

Furthermore, it means I believe in infant baptism and credocommunionism (the belief that only confessing adults in the Church should take the Eucharist); that I believe that the sacraments effect grace to the Christian -- not directly (as the Lutherans and Papists believe), but through the vehicle of faith in what the sacraments symbolize -- ; that I believe that the institution of the Church is best governed by, not Popes or lack of hierarchy, but by elders who assemble in larger councils when issues are raised within the Church; and that the institutions of Church and State are to remain separate in their functions, i.e. that the Church alone administers the sacraments and the Scriptures and binds the conscience as to its proper convictions, that the State alone bears the power of the sword (and that it is derelict in its duty if it does not exact violent justice on behalf of its citizens), and that modern man has perverted the American doctrine of Separation of Church and State by construing it to mean a separation of God and State. This is what is meant by "Presbyterian."

And finally, of course, I have no need to explain what is meant by "Christian." I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds; God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God; begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father, by whom all things were made. And I believe in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of Life; who proceeds from the Father and the Son; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets of the Old and New Testaments.

 

[GBJoker]

I don't believe anything. I don't believe in anything. Why would I?

Gravity still exists in the observable universe and still affects me whether I believe it or not.

I do follow Confucianism. And please don't call this a religion. To do so would be to prove ignorance of Confucianism.

 

[mizushinzui]

Personally I consider my self agnostic. If you don't know what that is it's basically (In my mind anyway) the belief that it's impossible to know what is actually going on so just have faith that there is something out there and you should be okay...
Well it's my version of agnostic anyway, I truelly think that if there is a god he made our minds too simple to understand something as complex as it (I use the term it because saying him or her either causes arguments or just confuses the matter that 'god' is too complex to understand in the first place so trying to give it a sex is rediculous)

 

[DarkLordSephiroth66]

never thought about it...............................

ive actually never contemplated my religious beliefs.

i consider myself a Christian(non-practicing).

I say non-practicing because i haven't been to a regular church service in almost 2 years(except for Christmas and Easter), and the fact that i have been a solitary Wiccan for 3 years. Yet i believe that Jesus died on the cross for our sins.

I also believe that everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, be it Christian, Wiccan, Jewish, Muslim, Atheist, Buddhist. I really don't care what you believe in, as long as you have something to believe in.

 

[Sir Fratley]

I believe there is a divine entity which created this universe via the Big Bang. After all, there needs to be something there, otherwise how can the universe be made if there's no matter there to create from?

We as humans will never know on this side of life whether we are right or wrong in our theories concerning the Divine and the hereafter. There are many intersecting laws governing morality that all seem to parallel each other, which gives some credence to a sense of universal morality. We have used and continue to use science to learn more about ourselves, our world, and the universe itself, but there are things beyond what science can prove or disprove. No amount of science can prove or disprove the existence of a 'soul'. No amount of science can prove or disprove that there is or is not a cycle of rebirth or life after death. And so I will continue to believe that there is something beyond this life.

I also believe that religion is a creation of humans with an intent to control others and is something that breeds discrimination against other religions, a form of spiritual government. Hence, I follow the path of spirituality, letting the Gods and Goddesses, Whom are Aspects of the Divine, guide me along my spiritual path.

 

[der Astronom]

We as humans will never know on this side of life whether we are right or wrong in our theories concerning the Divine and the hereafter. There are many intersecting laws governing morality that all seem to parallel each other, which gives some credence to a sense of universal morality. We have used and continue to use science to learn more about ourselves, our world, and the universe itself, but there are things beyond what science can prove or disprove. No amount of science can prove or disprove the existence of a 'soul'. No amount of science can prove or disprove that there is or is not a cycle of rebirth or life after death. And so I will continue to believe that there is something beyond this life.

Please define soul. If it is not a metaphorical concept, please also explain why you are so sure it exists.

 

[Sir Fratley]

Soul - a spiritual entity. As to why I believe it exists, I have had a past-life regression. I decided to double-check the information about who it was and how that person died, and it all checked out. The guy I 'was' in the past life regression was a civil war surgeon by the name of William Hammond. And just as of note, until then, I did not read much on the civil war aside from what I was taught in High School, and that name was never mentioned to me prior to the session. This past-life regression session was done in September of 2004.

 

[Jquestionmark]

I believe there is a divine entity which created this universe via the Big Bang. After all, there needs to be something there, otherwise how can the universe be made if there's no matter there to create from?

Though I'm sure this was probably rhetorical, I figured I'd answer anyways. Simply, if the sum total of this universe is zero (all of the negative and positive energy adds up to null), there wouldn't have to be anything for it to have been created from. Just food for thought.

I also believe that religion is a creation of humans with an intent to control others and is something that breeds discrimination against other religions, a form of spiritual government. Hence, I follow the path of spirituality, letting the Gods and Goddesses, Whom are Aspects of the Divine, guide me along my spiritual path.

This is kind of a weird question, but one I often ask people that see multiple gods and goddesses as part of a single entity. Do you mean that the divine is a thing, and the gods and goddesses are specific emanations from it (in the way that I am one person, though I have different moods at different times), or that the divine is an idea, and all gods and goddesses part of that category (in the way that we are all humans, but individuals)?

For example, (lets say I was a cook, for sake of simplicity) if I was a cook working at a restaurant, I would still be me, and not simply an aspect of "cook". For that matter, I'm not an aspect of "human," either, I'm an independent entity.

 

[der Astronom]

Soul - a spiritual entity.

And do you believe we can observe these spiritual entities? Like do we know what they look like?

As to why I believe it exists, I have had a past-life regression. I decided to double-check the information about who it was and how that person died, and it all checked out. The guy I 'was' in the past life regression was a civil war surgeon by the name of William Hammond. And just as of note, until then, I did not read much on the civil war aside from what I was taught in High School, and that name was never mentioned to me prior to the session. This past-life regression session was done in September of 2004.

You're referring to Hypnotism, right? It's actually been shown that hypnotism reveals nothing new or supernatural; what it actually boils down to is confirmation bias, and just really wanting to believe there was something you were supposed to see. If you are suggestive to the hypnotist, it goes easier, and they might even make you think up things that never even happened to you, or that you never knew about; in other words, it's all fabricated. I hate to break it to you, but that's what people have found out, and if you still believe it, I hold nothing against you. What you do with that knowledge is entirely up to you.

 

[Sir Fratley]

It would be one thing if I had previous knowledge about the person in question. However, since I had not, and the facts of what I saw are identical to recorded historical facts, I don't see how my mind could, by sheer luck, fabricate something so accurate without having any knowledge of the person's name or any other information about the person in question.

And besides, this thread is about what each of us believes, not a debate about whether what we believe is right or wrong in the eyes of other people. That's a separate thread, I believe. So for all you want to believe about everything as being dead and lifeless at the end, it will not change my beliefs.

 

[der Astronom]

It would be one thing if I had previous knowledge about the person in question. However, since I had not, and the facts of what I saw are identical to recorded historical facts, I don't see how my mind could, by sheer luck, fabricate something so accurate without having any knowledge of the person's name or any other information about the person in question.

That's what I meant by suggestion; you don't even have to have known anything about it; what most likely happened was that the hypnotist looked into some guy who died and made suggestions to you that would lead you to talking about the guy, even if you know nothing about him. And if you are receptive enough about hypnotism, it would work. (In other words, hypnotism is less likely to work on skeptics).

And besides, this thread is about what each of us believes, not a debate about whether what we believe is right or wrong in the eyes of other people. That's a separate thread, I believe. So for all you want to believe about everything as being dead and lifeless at the end, it will not change my beliefs.

Well, this is the debate forum, and I was just curious. We are here debating ideas, not to change people's beliefs. What you believe is up to you. Whether or not your beliefs have any sort of rational basis is a different matter.

 

[Sir Fratley]

That's what I meant by suggestion; you don't even have to have known anything about it; what most likely happened was that the hypnotist looked into some guy who died and made suggestions to you that would lead you to talking about the guy, even if you know nothing about him. And if you are receptive enough about hypnotism, it would work. (In other words, hypnotism is less likely to work on skeptics).

If I were alone, this would be a possibility. However, this was a group session, and there were people that were simply observers, buddies from my unit (10th Combat Support Hospital). All that was done was those of us who volunteered to participate went into hypnosis and were asked to describe what we see and what we feel. I saw myself writing a letter with a quill pen, and the name I saw written was signed William Hammond, hence where I got the name of the person. Nothing was being suggested to me during my turn, and I had people there that could verify that the hypnotist was not doing anything more than asking me what I was seeing and what I was feeling.